Glide is NOT broken

People already claiming control is dead and Glide is just too powerful for control to handle it also it ruins card advantage.. except.. it doesn't.

I will explain first of all Glide is worse than Divine Favor it costs 1 more and you need to empty your hand entirely or else you won't draw everything also when outcast vs aggro mirror it's giving your opponent fuel as well and you need at least 3 cards to NOT outcast it (it being the middle one) so you draw 2 card for 4 mana(for reference Arcane Intellect.. or Spectral Sight) it's below average there.

Divine Favor at least drew you 1-2 cards vs aggro.

About card advantage, the player playing outcasted Glide is always at a card DISADVANTAGE they draw 4 cards, the opponents draws 4 cards and then the opponent draws one card in their next turn, which means the oppponent have 5 cards and the DH have 4 cards.. also it can't have more than 5 mana to play them cause he had to at least play the last drawn card of the last turn (and there are no 0 mana cards in DH anymore), the card will be played at minimum turn 7 or so.. and by then the average control card is just better/more effective than an aggro card.

Another point- decks playing Glide will be highly telegraphed they are HYPER aggro, so you control whinners can play cards instead of hoarding them in your hand until your AOE is perfect against their board.. also it's what you should do anyway.. there's also an important factor.. your current hand isn't always desirable.. a free Plot Twist for you might be something you want to do anyway.. specially if you are quest warlock, they just healed you up with Aranasi Broodmothers.

So control is dead cause of a situational draw card? nope.. is the community overreacting? yes.

Against aggro, I am completely agreed with you, as most of the time your opponent gets the extra draw for free. In control, as I understood the mechanic is a strong play. A control hand in turns 5-8 easily can hold 6-8 cards. So what I understand about that mechanic is that both players put their hand in the deck an draw 4 cards. So, as DH you draw gain +3 or +4 in card advantage your opponent gain -1 -3 AFTER they draw on his turn. Basically mess up with the mulligan hand and gets cards back to your opponents deck.

Note: If the card do not work in that way, may you got the point.

I think this card is pretty cool.

You can either remove your opponents clutch card or give it to them - vice versa for yourself :)

Also, Warlocks running Aranasi Broodmother will be thankful. :P

Quote From Vaha

Against aggro, I am completely agreed with you, as most of the time your opponent gets the extra draw for free. In control, as I understood the mechanic is a strong play. A control hand in turns 5-8 easily can hold 6-8 cards. So what I understand about that mechanic is that both players put their hand in the deck an draw 4 cards. So, as DH you draw gain +3 or +4 in card advantage your opponent gain -1 -3 AFTER they draw on his turn. Basically mess up with the mulligan hand and gets cards back to your opponents deck.

Note: If the card do not work in that way, may you got the point.

Could hold.. but you realize it's aggro DH(the only deck that is interested in running Glide) by turn 3 so you use more of your removal tools and don't use draw cards to not spend your mana on not gaining more advantage... also who said your mulligan hand is that good? if it is good against the matchup (aggro) you should've played those good cards and your extra cards you are losing are just high cost cards that generally are there as your win condition vs other control decks or midrange so they made you a favor and switched them for potentially better cards against an hyper aggro matchup. in general the card advantage changes yet it might have been +5 in your favor as far as card advantage goes.. but it's always a +1 card advantage after an outcasted Glide (unless they spent more mana for more draw).

The card isn't bad after all it's a draw 4 for 4 if there's an empty hand it's situational.. but looking at Divine Favor.. it's not as strong if you had 6+ cards in hand Divine Favor was 6 cards drawn for 3.

I will state another point.. control decks against aggro do NOT have 8 card hands normally.. they need to use their removal, in that situation they might draw you cards or just plot twisted you for free.. and who cares all the cards in your decks should be good if you built it as a control deck which should be good vs aggro.

The only control class that have large hands just cause they can even against aggro is warlock and they got as mentioned [Hearthstone Card (aransi broodmother) Not Found], and if the glide strategy is prevalent they might as well run quest to abuse it.

Control is definitely not dead because of one card.

Yet Glide is broken, and when it is not, it's still TERRIBLY UNPLEASANT to play against.

It's also NOT a free Plot Twist, because you're gonna get fixed 4 cards as opposed to many more in the average case scenario.

And there's a whole lot of a difference between you deciding when to reshuffle, and your opponent deciding for you, on top of best benefit on his side.

That goes together with the fact that your hand in average is not bad, and you were playing with a plan in mind built upon your hand status. A reshuffle ruins that, and in average won't give you a better status than what you were building with a multi-turn strategy.

In Aggro vs Aggro, DH still has the best cards in the game, so a slight card advantage on your opponent does not matter much.

In the very best case scenario of benefitting the opponent more than the DH, the opponent will feel like he had no control whatsoever over his game. The DH has it both in good and in bad.

WoW! Great design! As if there wasn't enough hate around DH!

The only way for this card to be acceptable would be being utterly UNPLAYABLE. But if it turns out to be viable, it's a toxic card.

I just hope this card won't be nerfed to (5) (Odd-cost) for the sake of Wild. 

Inbetween Aggro DH replaces Odd thanks to unnecessarily insane cards released upon insane cards for the sake of NU CLASS MUST LIVE...

Its funny there is always an uproar against cards that are effectively tech cards against control decks. Its good that greed is being punished aswell. There needs to be options a players can use to mess with control players aswell, just like there are tech cards against combo and aggro. 

It is not broken, but it is

• unfun to play against,
• makes complete archetypes useles (handbuff, cost reduction, combo ... to name a few)
• and therefore limits future game design,...

Guys.

IMHO (4) draw 4 is not balanced. I don't care what people say or how they react. If you think that's fair, it's your opinion.
The outcast effect is ok for me, it's cool, but the cost is wrong and there's no punish scenarios at all.
I would have tried to balance this in other ways, like punishing the top deck and running completely out of cards:

Maybe people is going nuts because of the color of the card, or maybe the card will be a problem itself.
But please don't get that moralist!

"Lol just waste your aoe against 2 minions then when they shuffle your AOE back to the bottom of the deck you could have used them" 

There the card is fixed, not broken anymore i am a genius!

Oh wait. If you're wasting all your aoe against a busted aggro deck early you won't have any for later, which means you have already lost. So it's either waste your aoe on boards that are manageable now, or not have it for later. What fun game design. I'm glad the aggrocentric community of this site, where they constantly want warrior deleted if it has even a tier 3 control-based deck isn't biased against this card at all.

Not to mention, that screwing with mulligan shouldn't be a thing. Hand disruption is understandable, and since they don't want to print mill to screw with greedy control players they see this as their best option? "Fuck you i know you played a bunch of draw to keep card advantage against your greedy aggro opponent that just tempos out cards no matter what they are, throw those four cards you needed to the bottom of your deck" "I know you kept that card from the mulligan specifically because you queued into a demon hunter where it's useful more than any other matchup, but it costs more than four mana, so back to the bottom of your deck it goes." 

Fun Game. Both to play with and against blizzard....

4 mana topdeck draw 4 in aggro is good, I dont know though - demon hunter is tempo orientated in it's nature, and this isnt a tempo card unless it's a topdeck on hyperaggro lists. 

Might see play, needs to be a good control DH archtype first and I'm yet to see a good list there. 

Also:

"This card helps your plot twist warlock complete their quest so it's fair!!!"

Congrats the card is balanced because it helps out a meme deck, with a shitty quest reward that fatigues yourself with no aoe, that already lost easily to demon hunter before this latest influx of new bullshit DH cards.

Its not really that bad, honestly. You made some worthy points, and I will add that even control decks rarely have more than 5 cards when facing down tempo dhunters. If you're not playing cards every turn against dhunters, chances are good you will lose that matchup anyway.

But as pointed out by others, this card is problematic because;

- Its not fun to be at the receiving end of this card, especially if you get rng-ed to death by your draws

- It can be discovered, so even if the card itself doesn't make the cut, there will be games where this just blow the opponent away, in the most unfun fashion ever seen

- It actively punishes card draw , and for some archetypes and indeed classes, its simply impossible to play around. What does, for example, handlock propose to do against something like this? Another severe example would be the fact that priest cant draw for shit, so this just hit the entire class.

- Anything that can affect the opponent's hand needs to come with severe drawbacks to be remotely justified. There's a good reason why warlock, thus far anyway, is the only class that has hand disruption tools. This is being given to one of the best tempo-face class in the meta currently. Not a good sign.

The only drawback of this card is, in my opinion;

- You need to play this card, at a cost of 4 mana. Not many aggro decks can do that without losing tempo, which in some matches are game ending

- In some matches this just ensures you can't outcast other cards. If this gets stuck on your left side and you're holding more than 4 cards, then its one of those russian roulette games again where die if you do, die if you don't. Of course, this also means you almost never play skull with this card in the same deck. A worthy tradeoff? considering that skull was the only card that breaks Altruis the Outcast, one of the strongest cards in the game right now.

Yes, this does not kill control as an archetype, but its a little like quest rogue, in that control decks might as well just auto concede when it appears. Or like aggro against odd warrior. See it, know your win rate is just near the 30 percentage, just concede and save time.

I can only hope that this have actually went through play testing and found to be impossible to include into tempo dhunters. Also, there's plenty of new cards unrevealed down the line, so let's sit on this until we see everything before  crucifying Glide upside down under the sun.

Quote From dapperdog

Its not really that bad, honestly. You made some worthy points, and I will add that even control decks rarely have more than 5 cards when facing down tempo dhunters. If you're not playing cards every turn against dhunters, chances are good you will lose that matchup anyway.

But as pointed out by others, this card is problematic because;

- Its not fun to be at the receiving end of this card, especially if you get rng-ed to death by your draws

- It can be discovered, so even if the card itself doesn't make the cut, there will be games where this just blow the opponent away, in the most unfun fashion ever seen

- It actively punishes card draw , and for some archetypes and indeed classes, its simply impossible to play around. What does, for example, handlock propose to do against something like this? Another severe example would be the fact that priest cant draw for shit, so this just hit the entire class.

- Anything that can affect the opponent's hand needs to come with severe drawbacks to be remotely justified. There's a good reason why warlock, thus far anyway, is the only class that has hand disruption tools. This is being given to one of the best tempo-face class in the meta currently. Not a good sign.

 

The only drawback of this card is, in my opinion;

- You need to play this card, at a cost of 4 mana. Not many aggro decks can do that without losing tempo, which in some matches is game ending

- In some matches this just ensures you can't outcast other cards. If this gets stuck on your left side and you're holding more than 4 cards, then its one of those russian roulette games again where die if you do, die if you don't. Of course, this also means you almost never play skull with this card in the same deck. A worthy tradeoff? considering that skull was the only card that breaks Altruis the Outcast, one of the strongest cards in the game right now.

 

Yes, this does not kill control as an archetype, but its a little like quest rogue, in that control decks might as well just auto concede when it appears. Or like aggro against odd warrior. See it, know your win rate is easily near the 30s, just concede and save time.

I can only hope that this have actually went through play testing and found to be impossible to include into tempo dhunters. Also, there's plenty of new cards unrevealed down the line, so let's sit on this until we see everything before crucifying Glide upside down under the sun.

They don't test anything anymore, remember when they said that they wouldn't print two cards that were bullshit if combined in the standard set? Well....

Grave Rune + [Hearthstone Card (conniving infiltrator) Not Found] proves they don't care about that anymore. So what makes you think they care. It's literally KFT 2 demon hunter boogaloo, where they want more players to join the game off busted new mechanics of a broken new class, and they don't care if they screw over the other older ones, because if new players wanted to play those ones they would have done it already. Just when you think it's settling down, where they nerfed all the demon hunter cards they intentionally released with the intention of being batship busted. Here comes the expansion to say:

Your other characters are immune is more bullshit than houndmaster shaw could ever be, a card that carried hunter all the way until it got put in wild. You're always going to be ahead on board. All this card does against aggro is give your opponent a turn to try to catch up to you until you play your next cycle of bullshit DH cards. And against control it singlehandedly wins you the matchup unless they're mage and they just played an elemental last turn with Elemental Allies to draw their aoe back again. Which is so fringe it's glide's downside. Literally nothing.