The Price Of Progress - Card Design Competition Discussion Thread

  • anchorm4n's Avatar The Cake Is A Lie 1570 1595 Posts Joined 03/13/2019
    Posted 1 month, 2 weeks ago

    Thanks for all your feedback so far. Looks like my ideas were even worse than I thought lol. I'll go with something more boring I guess.

    It's a recycled card from season 1, adjusted to this weeks theme. Feign Death on a stick seemed to weak, so I doubled up on it. Funny how that feels a lot more threatening somehow. The restriction rules out Oblivitron, Savannah Highmane, Seeping Oozeling, Khartut Defender and OG Sylvanas herself of course. Not sure what to do about the card text. With four lines it produces an orphan, at -2 and -3 it collides with the Attack value and at everything smaller it jumps back to 4 lines until it becomes minuscule. Strange. 

    Also sorry for the late response to your ideas, life has kept me busy this week.

    Me0203
    Nice to have you back! Greenskin is the least crazy of the three, but I'd say he offers the best chances to win this competition. Not having 5 Cost cards is no big issue for a Pirate deck with a few weapons, so it would definitely find a home. The art might be better, but that's a minor issue.

    Wailor
    One of my favourites so far. I like the 3 cost version the most because that's a huge price to pay for mage (no secrets, no AI) which is only fitting for such a powerful effect. 5 stars from me!

    Lundy
    Ooof, this super strong. Having no 8 cost cards is a really small price for the rewards this card offers. You should really go down to 4. I do like all the thought you have put into your cards, it's amazing how you managed to mirror the WoW experience. It's sad to hear that you can't submit that many tokens. If you want to hear my advice, I'd try to come up with something completely different and keep these cards in store for a better occasion instead of crippling such an amazing concept.

    linkblade91
    Very solid card, I like it. One thing I'd try to adjust is getting "2/2" and "Treant" into one line if possible. Edit: ooops, I kinda overlooked the part where it says "this game". Now that might be too much. But I see how it's necessary because you can't combine the restriction with an aura effect. Tricky.

    Deminxz95
    I really like the flavor behind your card, exploring the other side of Sylvanas is a cool idea. I do think the reward is too weak though, even if cutting 4 cost cards isn't too big of a problem for Hunter.

    DestroyerR
    Damn, I'm using this art as my profile pic on the OoC Discord and I didn't think of using it for this competition. I like your idea and the way it has shaped out on Discord.

    R
    One of my favourites so far. Very well done!

    Longshadow
    Loreseeker Cho wouldn't work since you can't discover at the end of your turn. Even if that was possible I think the reward wouldn't be good enough for such a huge sacrifice because your opponents would clear this ASAP. Professor Jones is a nice idea, it fits the archaeologist theme pretty well. Be careful with the number of tokens though, I'm not sure if you can submit more than two.

    I notice I am confused. Something I believe isn't true. How do I know what I think I know?
    Harry James Potter-Evans-Verres, hpmor.com

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  • Lundy's Avatar Protector of Elwynn 1095 493 Posts Joined 06/21/2019
    Posted 1 month, 2 weeks ago

     

    Since I can't use an absurd amount of tokens for my card, I had to come up with another idea. 

    My first thought was to have the Warlock hero power also damage the enemy hero, but it was a lot of text on the card, so went another direction. This will now upgrade the hero power to Soul Tap, fitting for the Soulrender. Biggest issue I have is maintaining the flavor of the original. This doesn't have Spell Damage nor direct card draw. Thoughts on scrapping the hero power upgrade and instead having it read "... 2-Cost card, give your hero +1 Spell Damage for the rest of the game" or something to that effect?

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  • Me0203's Avatar 645 362 Posts Joined 06/13/2019
    Posted 1 month, 2 weeks ago

    Comments! Thoughts. Community engagement.

    Wailor!

    Wailor

    This version of the Wise Old Ant is both fun, competitive, and succinct, which is lovely. I like the 4-cost one best, if only because 3-mana 2-4 is a well-traveled road for Mage. A 4-mana 2-7 feels more impressive.

    Linkblade!

    Show Spoiler

    Your change was a good one, I think. The new version allows a more flexible gameplan and is more in-line with the direction they're pushing Druid. That said, though, the effect seems very strong. Druid can bash out 2-4 spells a turn easily - imagine having this dude down on turns 1-4 and then continuing? Thankfully there's no Savage Roar these days, but still, that's scary - the sort of game-defining scary that Classic legendaries should be, which is why I'm torn. More powerful is always better, so I'd go with it, unless you can think of an artful way to tune the card down.

    R!

    Show Spoiler

    Already in. Thoughts, though - this card, like some others, feels like the Barrens Kazakus - it's not something you'd build around, but if there are only two or three 3-cost cards in your deck, why not cut them for the powerspike? Neutral cards with that sort of 'well, why not include it?' feel are the sort that can ruin expansions. Thankfully, Barrens Kazakus is quite interesting and 4-mana is a tough slot, so it's alright. Master Overspark isn't as interesting, though, so doesn't feel worth the risk. It's a neat card, and a fun one, but not something I'd want to see in the game.

    Anchorman!

    Show Spoiler

    Indeed, destroying all of your opponent's anything is scary! It makes sense to bring Sylvanas back as a Hunter card, though, given the hero skin - that's an exciting sort of boldness. The effect is bland at the moment, though. If a 3-mana card that triggers Deathrattles doesn't see play, would this one? Perhaps, admittedly, but I'm more wary than excited. There should be another way to retrofit Sylvanas' flavor (mucking with your opponents minions) with Hunter. A Freezing Trap-esque effect? Maybe a Hysteria-like effect where you choose an enemy minion to attack the others? You could do a lot in that arena - choose an enemy minion and its attack and health explode, are stolen, distributed among your minions, an effect activates for each ATK or HP, etc.

    Destroyer!

    Show Spoiler

    This is hilarious. I wouldn't label it a winner, because at end of day he's just a mediocre Rush minion, but the combination of effect, art, and history are more than enough for me to give 4 stars anyway. Maybe tweak it elegantly with flavor in mind, but if not, go! Live the dream!

    Demon!

    Show Spoiler

    Admittedly, much as I appreciate that you've taken a new direction, it's hard to swallow such a radical shift for a character that we're familiar with. I'd love if she were one of several cards that told the story of Classic legendaries through re-imaginings, but that's beyond the scope of the competition. To really sell me on the idea, I think that either the effect should be cooler or there should be some callback to Classic Sylvanas. Maybe you could work minion muckery into the card, somehow? "Give a weapon x attack for x enemy minions." is a dumb, overpowered idea, but it could be an avenue. "Destroy an enemy minion. Its ATK and HP become your weapon's ATK and Durability for a turn." … actually, that's badass. Part of me wants to steal it for my own use!

    Lundy!

    Show Spoiler

    The token rule really disappoints me, because your original idea is my favorite design so far. Admittedly, no relation to the original besides a tribal tag, but he's just so TOOTHSOME! Who cares if immune effects have an evil history in every other card game I know? I want it. I want my majestic, impenetrable storm daddy.

    Cough. Anyway. Thalnos. Is Thalnos a Warlock in WoW? As a Hearthstone-exclusive chump, this feels odd. He's a tough card to reimagine, since the original effects are so basic and succinct (same with Al'Akir, actually. You choose tough cookies!), but I think there ought to be more connection to the original than there is now. Your current effect feels niche and broken. If you continue down this path, perhaps you could have him play into the self-damage aspect of Warlock instead - something like "Your Hero Power costs 0. Cards you draw this turn have Spell Damage +1." or "Activate your Hero Power twice." My general thought is that he should be, like the original, an all-around useful card that helps Warlock do Warlock things a l'il more easily or efficiently, rather than a deck-definer or a finisher. If you do want to be bold and create a finisher, I'd play to the draw or spell damage aspects - two ideas could be, "Deal 1 damage to your opponent whenever you draw a card." or "Gain +1 Spell Damage whenever you draw a card. If your deck has no 2-cost cards, your Hero Power costs (0) this turn."

    That's a lot. Sorry. I have too much free time at the moment, obviously!

     

    How do y'all add titles to the spoiler tags?

    Better call Thrall!

     

     

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  • Hordaki's Avatar Dragon Scholar 650 261 Posts Joined 05/28/2019
    Posted 1 month, 2 weeks ago

    Had to scrap my first idea because I thought it was any previous legendary and not just Classic, but I'll still post the feedback I had.

    Feedback:

    Show Spoiler

    Lundy: Thalnos is simple but useful, I like it.

    Anchorm4n: This could be a pretty powerful card, although something about the ability doesn't fit for me.

    Me0203: Out of the three, I'd say Gruul is the most interesting.

    Wailor: I'd go with the 4-Mana version.

    linkblade91: You might want to increase the mana cost to 6 or 7, this is a pretty powerful card early and it's not hard for Druid to get to 5 mana early enough for this to have a big impact

    Demonxz95: Pretty powerful effect if you build your deck right, I like it.

    DestroyerR: Good card. I kinda wish this still had Charge, but that's just me (it would be completely broken with it).

    R: Simple but effective and good flavor.

    Longshadow:  I like the flavor of Professor Jones, although the spells should probably cost 5 Mana.

          -Hordaki (rhymes with Mordecai)

           Check out the Tactician custom class!

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  • anchorm4n's Avatar The Cake Is A Lie 1570 1595 Posts Joined 03/13/2019
    Posted 1 month, 2 weeks ago

    Okay, last try with a more interesting take of Sylvanas:

     

    This captures the effect of OG Sylvanas and the flavor of the Forsaken since it raises your opponent's dead minions to fuel your own army. It obviously sucks against Token decks but that never stopped OG Sylvanas from being good. Summoning two units should acertain that this is a solid play at least stat-wise (comparable to Jandice).

    Which version is better? "Resurrect" is an established mechanic, but it has never been applied to enemy minions before, so the second version might be the safe way to go. I don't want people to think the card summons minions for your opponent. Some late feedback would be great!

    @Lundy: Making a Thalnos card is very ambitious. I can easily picture him in Warlock (a Bloodmage in the blood magic class), but the effect doesn't work out for me yet. Maybe you should focus on that aspect some more. What I imagine definesThalnos as a Bloodmage design-wise is having paid with his life force for the spell damage (low stats) and gaining resources upon death.

    @Me0203: Wow, what a great read! I have rarely seen such an elaborate an well verbalized post. I also appreciate it very much that you have given constructive criticism and made suggestions what we could do. If you want to polish up the spoilers, you start out as usual: type your text, mark it, click the "Spoiler" button. Then you add " text="name"" between the first brackets. Here's an example: {spoiler text="Me0203"} I hope this is understandable. Credits to Demonxz95 who taught me this in the first place.

    I notice I am confused. Something I believe isn't true. How do I know what I think I know?
    Harry James Potter-Evans-Verres, hpmor.com

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  • Alfi's Avatar Devoted Academic 1520 1087 Posts Joined 05/29/2019
    Posted 1 month, 2 weeks ago

    King Krush reimagined. What do you think?

    King Krush

    -=alfi=-

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  • Ilphelkiir's Avatar 520 236 Posts Joined 05/28/2019
    Posted 1 month, 2 weeks ago
    Quote From Alfi

    King Krush reimagined. What do you think?

    King Krush

    This is a strictly better king krush, even with 8 cost cards in your deck. And if you don't have 8 cost cards in your deck (not a hard requirement for hunter), this destroys a minion and gains a stat boost as well. I don't know how you could fix this card, as it basically has no requirement in most hunter decks.

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  • Demonxz95's Avatar Content Squad Crossroads Historian 1760 1868 Posts Joined 03/19/2019
    Posted 1 month, 2 weeks ago

    Further feedback.

    Me0203

    I think you forgot to change the watermark on Gruul because he still has the Classic one meaning he would technically exist in the same set as regular Gruul. Speaking of regular Gruul, I think it is a little bit off-putting that this card is a 1/1 whereas the original card in a 7/7. This is a huge size discrepancy, which is unfortunately just an inherent negative side-effect of the prompt.

    Millhouse is a cute idea, but I feel like it is side-stepping the rules of the prompt a little bit. Greenskin I think is definitely the best of the three, although I think he should have some guaranteed effect if you play him even without another Pirate.

    Your idea for my Sylvanas sounds pretty neat, although copying Durability for one turn is a bit weird and the more inward specifics of how that would work is not so clear.

    Anchorm4n
    This is very fitting of the original Sylvanas card, although having no 6-Cost cards is not a big condition to meet, especially in Hunter of all classes. I think this for this reason, I prefer the Neutral version even though it is definitely fitting as a Hunter card.

    Lundy
    I do believe this card is better than Al'Akir for the comp, although there is an argument to be made that the damage from Life Tap is not supposed to matter if you end up winning the game anyway.

    Alfi
    There are quite a few problems here. Namely that the card isn't actually called King Krush in any way on the card (which will lead people to vote is negatively just on principal). The effect is also missing the Battlecry keyword. One particularly glaring problem to me as well is the fact that it's a Classic card, meaning that it's a strictly better King Krush in the exact same set as King Krush (as well as the fact that this deckbuilding effect did not exist yet). Having no 8-Cost cards in your deck is also a very easy requirement to meet, especially in Hunter.

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  • Me0203's Avatar 645 362 Posts Joined 06/13/2019
    Posted 1 month, 2 weeks ago

    @Anchorman

    Thank you! Bless ya, that spoiler trick worked.

    I like this design. It's likely not as good as OG Sylvanas, but it occupies a fun niche - it's definitely a card that I'd slap in a deck whenever I could, like Bandersmosh. Regarding the wording, I think that the second is more clear and fits nicely within the box. Like Demon notes for Alfi's card, though, is it possible to work 'Sylvanas' into the card title?

    Better call Thrall!

     

     

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  • Wailor's Avatar Design Champion 410 363 Posts Joined 05/28/2019
    Posted 1 month, 2 weeks ago

    More feedback.

    Lundy
    Thalnos the Soulrender has a nice effect, even if it's a bit too unrelated to the original card for my taste. Besides that, nice card.

    Me0203
    I feel like all your cards are a bit too crazy, but I'd say I prefer Millhouse, Surge Protector. Most people liked Greenskin, but giving your weapon +6/+6 feels like way too much, even if it is susceptible to weapon removal.

    anchorm4n
    Banshee Queen, feel the beat of the living's scream!

    Ahem, in all seriousness, I really like your neutral version of The Banshee Queen. I prefer the second wording, since it's more clear.

    Also, I think the name is great, even if it doesn't contain the word "Sylvanas". She is a pretty recognisable character, so I doubt people would downvote you for that.

    Alfi
    As many people pointed out, it's way better than the original King Krush. How about giving it Rush instead of Charge? This way, it would be a two minion removal + a big body, which isn't bad for 8. But even then, the no 8-cost being too easy to fulfill would still be there.

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  • Lundy's Avatar Protector of Elwynn 1095 493 Posts Joined 06/21/2019
    Posted 1 month, 2 weeks ago

    Changed Thalnos to be more in line with his Classic counterpart. Like the OG, Thalnos gives Card Draw and Spell Damage. Not sure if I worded the card correctly to get what I wanted to convey across. Actually hope I can word this differently, as I had to space out the words so that they could fit the card frame. Honestly, I think this is trash and wouldn't vote for it. Going to go for something new and hope for the best lol

     

    Feedback:

    anchorm4n
    As others have said, I like the new effect of your card, as well as the wording of the 2nd example you posted. I feel the card isn't as good as the original due to having the restriction and not being able to somewhat target what you want, though I suppose the randomness is in line with OG Sylvanas. Nice work!

    Alfi
    Having a no 8-Cost restriction doesn't work well in this comp, as there isn't much competing for that spot anyways. However, due to having to have a steep restriction of no X-Cost cards, it allows you to go cheaper and keep the big effects that you want.

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  • Hordaki's Avatar Dragon Scholar 650 261 Posts Joined 05/28/2019
    Posted 1 month, 2 weeks ago

    Took some time to come up with a new card, here's what I've got. Ties into Brightwing's Legendary effects while serving as a potential combo piece.

    More feedback:

    Show Spoiler

    Anchorm4n: Go with the second version, it's more clear and still fits in the box. I like the new angle for the card.

    Alfi: Ridiculously overpowered currently. Switch to Rush, lower the base stats, and / or change the mana requirement.

    Lundy: Maybe make it say "replace your hero power with [insert name here]", and include a token with a new hero power with the original text plus the spell damage. I still prefer the first version you showed, but this one does have more connections to the original Thalnos.

          -Hordaki (rhymes with Mordecai)

           Check out the Tactician custom class!

    2
  • Me0203's Avatar 645 362 Posts Joined 06/13/2019
    Posted 1 month, 2 weeks ago

    @Hordecai

    Your new version is much better! Having seen it, I find it odd that they haven't printed a similar card before - all-legendary decks are such a popular meme, after all. Not to mention, she's a competitive card as well. Perhaps too competitive, but hey, unique and fun enough for me not to care. Only change I'd make is tweaking the title to 'Best Friend Brightwing', 'Brightwing, Lovable Companion', or something else that gets along the friendship aspect - she's helping someone else out, after all!

    Better call Thrall!

     

     

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  • anchorm4n's Avatar The Cake Is A Lie 1570 1595 Posts Joined 03/13/2019
    Posted 1 month, 2 weeks ago

    Really cool to see so much traffic in here that late in the competition! Here are some more thoughts from my side.

    Alfi
    I have seen a baby King Krush among the submissions with your effect on it. If that's your submission, well done! That's a cool card. If it isn't, you should create something else and file a complaint at Shadows because someone has stolen your idea.

    Lundy
    It's not bad, but I know that feeling when you're not happy with you card anymore after too many changes. I hope inspiration strikes soon!

    Hordaki
    Very solid card, I like it! Me0203's suggestion for an alternative name sounds pretty cool, too since OG Brightwing's entry text is quite iconic.

     

    I notice I am confused. Something I believe isn't true. How do I know what I think I know?
    Harry James Potter-Evans-Verres, hpmor.com

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  • linkblade91's Avatar Global Moderator Lissandra 1405 1422 Posts Joined 02/09/2019
    Posted 1 month, 2 weeks ago

    Good luck to everyone in the voting! I went ahead with my OP Cenarius, so I expect to lose great things!

    If you have the time, you should totally check out our weekly Hearthstone card design competitions! :D

    2
  • Demonxz95's Avatar Content Squad Crossroads Historian 1760 1868 Posts Joined 03/19/2019
    Posted 1 month, 2 weeks ago

    Damn, MathU. You gotta leave some competitions for other people to win (jk, congrats yet again).

    1
  • anchorm4n's Avatar The Cake Is A Lie 1570 1595 Posts Joined 03/13/2019
    Posted 1 month, 2 weeks ago

    Congrats to MathU once more! 

    I notice I am confused. Something I believe isn't true. How do I know what I think I know?
    Harry James Potter-Evans-Verres, hpmor.com

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  • linkblade91's Avatar Global Moderator Lissandra 1405 1422 Posts Joined 02/09/2019
    Posted 1 month, 2 weeks ago

    I'm definitely not the main winner now lol. Congrats MathU! This is the Season of Math!

    If you have the time, you should totally check out our weekly Hearthstone card design competitions! :D

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  • Me0203's Avatar 645 362 Posts Joined 06/13/2019
    Posted 1 month, 2 weeks ago

    What a competition. Look at how close those final scores are. Congratulations to MathU for edging out the other folks!

     

    Looking through the report, I'm most surprised by how CursedParrot's 'Antonidas, the Secretive' ended up. It doesn't have much relation to the original Aunty, sure, but the effect was so crazy! I gave it five stars on the principle of pure, wacky fun. Other folks very much didn't agree with that, haha.

    Better call Thrall!

     

     

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