Quote From Hordaki
I like the idea, but I feel like you should make it an Un'Goro minion and emphasize the Barnabus synergy in your description.
Hearthcards deck creating enthusiast. Also previously known on Hearthpwn as Cooler39140 and Huoyan.
Off of some feedback, here are some more traditional Murloc cards. I say "traditional" even though Priest is definitely not a traditional Murloc class nor is Freeze a mechanic typically seen on Murlocs (except for obviously Brrrloc).
I was initially hesitant to post Shoreline Gatherer when I noticed that Wailor already used the art after I already made it (and there had been no duplicate arts so far), but then I realized that people using the same art is probably just going to happen anyway.
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Not sure what's better - from hand or from deck?
Thanks for the feedback, I've updated The Wereloc from a few of the suggestions, with 2 versions:
The design intention was towards converting low-stat murlocs into more considerable threats in the mid-game, so I've switched it to only transform murlocs. Allowing for decks that run early-game murlocs and midgame non-murloc threats. As to the Rush mechanic, I'm concerned that it would give aggressive shaman decks too easy a chance to switch into a burst-damage gameplan by heavily stalling the board (that may not necessarily be a bad design result however). Thoughts?
Edit Re Anchorm4n below: Ringmaster's Baton, Farraki Battleaxe, Dragonrider Talritha don't include 'random' largely for text-box niceness, which is relevant enough here that I'm happy to exlude it, especially for the Rush version. of course it should normally be included.
@anchorm4n Lili'idan: A little close to Kayn's design for my liking. Mechnapper: I like, though I question how effective it would be at 4 mana as a tech card. Darktide Reaper: Unusual for a Murloc, a possibly decent control tool, but I'm not sure thats a positive in this case as it results in clear anti-synergy with other murlocs Unsure on this one.
@AeroJulwin Axolfin: I think this effect (or at least its wording) is probably too confusing to track in game. Overall I think the previous Necromancer is a more workable design.
@Cheese I wont repeat the concerns about Battlegrounds cards, and I'm not an expect BG player myself, so take my balance suggestions with a grain of salt: I think it should probably sit at tier 3/4 with a higher statline. +3/+3 can stack up quickly, and typically murloc builds want to quickly turn their early-game murlocs into large threats anyway - What this means is that you arent usually buying murlocs for their bodies anyway, and this buff is just better in most circumstances. Tier3/4 puts this into a tier where you're more likely to be at a stage of the game where you're looking for this effect in particular.
@Neoguli Nice simple design, balance is great. Flavour is hard to judge without knowing the "set" that would existing around it, could be better on that front if you want it to hit home as a standalone card.
@Wailor Holyfin Crusader is a bit more interesting - stick with it I think.
@shatterstar1998 I like the Vilefin Spawner with the 1/1's. Though I think you could probably just summon the 1/1 if you want to be more direct. The flavour of it could use some improvement, the link between "Vilefin Spawner" and tradeable that generates murlocs isn't thematically clear.
@Demonxz95 I really like Shoreline Gatherer: meets a good ground between interesting mechanical twist on murlocs and suiting the class/tribe/flavour of Murloc oracles etc. I'd limit the effect to when friendly characters are healed however; same reasoning as to the old Eaglehorn Bow change. And yes, keeping that art should be fine.
@R I like cunning Tidehunter - fits well into what Murlocs do and can serve as a nice board refill tool for those decks. Might be possible to just check for other Murlocs, to give it a bit of an easier time in the inevitable shaman and paladin decks it'll end up it.
Thank you all for your feedback! While the majority seems to prefer Lil'idan, I feel way more comfortable with Mechnapper. The flavor wasn't immediately clear to everyone, so I've zoomed in on the art, that hopefully helps. Now I'd be very grateful for some help with the balance. Some of you said it's too weak and wouldn't see play, so I made another version that steals a Mech with up to 3 Attack. Which one is better? Any other ideas regarding the stats? Should it be cheaper?
Looks like Zilliax makes the whole difference, but that card was run in nearly every deck as long as it was in Standard, so yeah, maybe it's worth it to go to 3 Attack.
I notice I am confused. Something I believe isn't true. How do I know what I think I know?Harry James Potter-Evans-Verres, hpmor.com
I'm dead set on trying a BG card for this theme. For science.
Still not sure at which tier I should put it.
I must also add that the meal gives +3/+3 to ANY minion. When you play Cookie, you're definitely NOT playing murloc. Also, one precision: If you buy the 3rd copy of a murloc it will still become golden and not turn into a meal since the text on Cookie says "after".
Alright, we're a few versions in, but I think this is the final result. Although I think the enchantment mechanic fits Murlocs because they focus on buffing each other, it ultimately proofed too complex, so I removed it. I did keep the Battlecry for reliability and to prevent a boardwipe using Lushwater Scout.
I added the Stealth effect for several reasons. For starters I didn't want it to just be a Soul of the Murloc with a body, so I wanted to add something extra. Because I originally designed the card for board sustain, Stealth seemed like the obvious choice. As a happy coincidence it also fits the flavor.
Although it's clearly better than Soul of the Murloc, I think keeping it a Rare card should be fine considering it is exclusive to Murlocs whereas Soul of the Murloc targets all friendly minions.
People seem to like my first idea a lot more. So I decided to focus on that. Change the name to Vilefin Trafficker to get the idea of Tradeable coming more across:
Feedback to cards since my last post:
Demonxz95: Both of them are quite creative. I think the first Murloc should be a Mage card to fit in with the Freeze synergy and the potential power level.
R: The from hand effect is fine. From deck is just too powerful of a comeback tool and if you do you should increase the cost to 5.
Cheese: The new version with Tier 3 seem fine. Fit great in mid range playstyle.
Aero Juwin: The card seem fine but would be super annoying and doesn't fit with Murloc at all since they are supposed to have little guard against board clear.
Just as a reminder so we're all clear, I HATE Murlocs. They're quintessential stupid aggro bullshit wrapped in an ugly fish-frog skin. With that bias in mind, let's begin:
shatterstar1998 - I like the idea of using Tradeable, even though it doesn't feel like something you "trade" or have to do with trading/merchants in general. The name-change helps in that regard, at least. "Discover a Murloc" is more powerful than the Tinyfin, of course, but I still feel like it might be the way to go. For flavor and power reasons: spending 1 mana to cycle a card means you're not spending the mana to build your board and go face, so the payoff has to be worth it.
AeroJulwin - Soul of the Murloc aside, Murlocs are supposed to be weak to clearing. Ignoring that for a moment, something else is that the Ghosts are not Murlocs, which the deck won't appreciate because it wants to stay "in tribe" for synergies and the like. If we want to forcibly yank the tribe away from its aggressive tendencies into something different then I'm all for it; I just don't think this is the way to go about that.
Cheese - When I first saw your card I was concerned with it being Tier 2, so updating it to Tier 3 or 4 is a step in the right direction in my opinion. I think Tier 3 might be okay. It's weird that you would be essentially playing any-other tribe beyond Murlocs, and just using Cookie's effect to buff your Dragons/Eles/whatever, but it's still interesting. For science!
anchorm4n - I say "YOLO, let it steal Zilliax!" Not sure if this should exist in the same expansion as E.M.P. Operative with regards to Mech-hate, but it's not the worst thing. It can also steal a SN1P-SN4P played straight, by the way. I will say though that this is a Murloc in flavor only and that might hurt you. It doesn't have to be a Murloc at all; it just happens to be one.
Arkasaur - Frankly, I think the non-Rush version is too boring. You're just making "vanilla" 4/3s; there's got to be more utility than that to warrant being an effective Legendary. I've also seen this art + name + effect like four separate times in my card-making "career", so something to keep in mind I guess.
R - With some tweaking of the flavor, you could shift the Cunning Tidehunter to Kobolds & Catacombs and incorporate Recruit. Might be worth a consideration *shrugs* Not to say it's bad as-is or anything like that; I just think the flavor is lackluster.
Demonxz95 - I shudder to think of Murlocs expanding out to Priest, of all things. Healing in said deck would also be super weird, but I applaud the dramatic reversal of "the Murloc way" (i.e: Aggro), so maybe the originality will benefit you. I really don't like Glacier Crystalfin because the Murloc aspect feels tacked-on: it's a Freeze-related card that happens to be a Murloc.
Wailor - I would just stick with Holyfin Crusader. The art makes perfect sense with the class, and it just…works.
Lundy - Tirion Forgrgl is a meme; some people will like that, and some people will very much not. I prefer the Broodmother because it's "an actual card" and not a gimmick. Cost feels really high, but not sure how to tone it down.
Neoguli - I'm sure someone would find a way to break it when more deck cost-reduction cards come into existence. If it could draw 1-Cost cards you could pair it with Spirit of the Dead and its ilk, or just to draw the other Seashore Tinyfin. Don't know if that would pull too far away from your "kawaii" intentions, though :P
Hordaki - I like the Merchant because it pushes you to build your deck differently. You can't just go all-Murlocs-all-day; you would need to incorporate Tradeable cards. I think the text is fine as-is :)
If you have the time, you should totally check out our weekly Hearthstone card design competitions! :D
I changed my Warlock card to an Epic and made it say "to (do X)" to make sure that a Murloc is destroyed for the board-buff. I tried to fit the text on three lines but it doesn't look good. For your consideration, I also included two new cards based on the art I found in my stash:
Murlocs too small to push through that Taunt? Want to double-up after all your Murlocs attacked? Suddenly feel like going tall after you built that wide board? Franken-Mrrgl has got you covered. Maybe he should say "to gain their stats" instead of just +3/+3.
Inquiring Shock-Fin doesn't need to be a Murloc, to be fair. The Rush is implied to be from the shock-stick in its hand, probing them lol. Name could stand to be better.
I've actually been slowly trying to make a Murloc expansion so this I've got a few ideas
Quote From AnAngryBadgerI've actually been slowly trying to make a Murloc expansion so this I've got a few ideas
Just looking for some feedback.
Quote From KangTheConquerorJust looking for some feedback.
In my opinion, you can't have both effects at the same time on a single card. Either have the face damage, or have the free Murlocs; both makes the card self-sufficient after the first death. You just loop the 1/1s repeatedly for board clearing and face damage, which is simply too much. It's that or it definitely needs to be a Legendary, but even then...
Quote From linkblade91Quote From KangTheConquerorJust looking for some feedback.In my opinion, you can't have both effects at the same time on a single card. Either have the face damage, or have the free Murlocs; both makes the card self-sufficient after the first death. You just loop the 1/1s repeatedly for board clearing and face damage, which is simply too much. It's that or it definitely needs to be a Legendary, but even then...
Then I'll make it 3 mana with just the face damage effect.
I already posted Holyfin Crusader, but I droped the Divine Shield on the main body as Hordaki suggested bc it seemed a bit too strong.
Anyways, more feedback:
About your cards, I think Glacier Crystalfin is my favorite, but both the artwork and the effect scream Shaman to me. You could even put it in Knights of the Frozen Throne, since that expansion featured both Freeze and Murloc synergy for Shaman.
On the one hand, it is very good on Lightfang builds, because it allows you to spend gold without needing a free slot, which is something these builds tend to struggle with.
On the other hand, it's completely unplayable in most Murloc builds, because it doesn't allow you to use their Battlecries, which is the build strenght.
All in all, I'd say Tavern Three is more appropriate, but it's really hard to tell.
Gillidari Avenger is also neat, but it would need more support than it currently has, so maybe some people punish that a little bit.
The other two cards have neat effect (especially Tinyfin, the Unkillable, although the artwork is too blurry), but I don't see the need for them to be Murlocs.
Went with Franken-Mrrgl; thank you Wailor. I will blame you if I lose lol :)
I hate Murlocs, so submitting a card that destroys your Murlocs seems on point.
Feedback time while the reveals are paused. Glacier Crystalfin seems to be the popular choice, so I think I'll go with that one. I kinda want to keep it Neutral though (specifically if I put it in KotFT as Shaman having both it and Brrrloc in the same set would be a little bit weird). Skipping a few people who have already submitted if I don't have anything to add to the discussion.
Zooming in on the art actually does help with the flavor. Pretty smart thinking!
I do think it's perhaps a bit too "on the nose" in terms of being a Zilliax counter, but I think the flavor alone will have a good chance of carrying you forward.
Tinyfin, the Unkillable has some funny flavor, but the artwork is too pixelated and is obviously a zoomed-in version of Tinyfin's Caravan.
Gillidari Avenger is definitely my favorite of the bunch, though suiciding Murlocs for a measly +1 Attack boost per Murloc is usually not going to do as much damage as simply just using them to attack face instead. Thus, I think it renders the card a bit situational.
Mushfin Murloc and Mana Murloc I'm unfortunately not a big fan of. The former doesn't feel like a Choose One design that would be printed and I think it's a bit that one choice is basically just Coldlight Oracle, and the latter feels too cluttered in different effects of which not all of them feel very Druid-like.
I think I really need to work on giving feedback more often because a lot of people submit and then I have something else to add to the cards they made.
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