This new meta report https://www.vicioussyndicate.com/wild-vs-data-reaper-report-25/ just came out today which is stat based, not opinion based, and it shows secret mage as the best deck by a large margin and having favored or highly favored matchups into every other deck except pirate warrior, where the matchup is neutral. So there is no meta counter to this deck. I wonder what experiences everyone is having with wild ladder related to secret mage?
I didn't play much ladder recently, but i never had much trouble with them.
Though, that could be because I usually play rather defensive Reno decks.
Long, drawn-out Control Match-ups with Boardclears en masse and an unbelievable amount of greedy cards?
Sign me up!
Reno priest used to be very favored as was reno mage. However, after this expansion’s new cards for secret mage the matchup has shifted. Did you play before the expansion or after? Also, the new refined secret mage was only popularized in the past month so maybe you played before then.
Coinflip with Deathrattle Hunter. If they don't draw like a god, they really have to work for their win.
Double the pride, double the fall.
Is it possible your hunter list is somehow better against them than the standard one or you are playing it better than most people? Based on vicious syndicate stats secret mage is highly favored but maybe most people misplay in that matchup. Any specific suggestions for how to play deathrattle hunter in that matchup or any cards you use different than their list?
Quote From SwizardReno priest used to be very favored as was reno mage. However, after this expansion’s new cards for secret mage the matchup has shifted. Did you play before the expansion or after? Also, the new refined secret mage was only popularized in the past month so maybe you played before then.
played till the week before christmas. i started laddering again this week for a bit, so maybe i just haven't experienced the full force of the recent Secret Mage yet. I've seen some decks that run stuff like Sayge and Rigged Faire Game.
I'm 14-2 against them with reno priest. But as the report mentions I don't know how many of those secret mages were running Occult Conjurer, I don't remember seeing the card a lot. So my high winrate might be due to them running suboptimal builds.
Needless to say the deck is extremely boring to play (against). And considering half of the games I play I face the deck, I've switched back to standard-only for now.
Reno priest being tier 2 in the report is silly to me, though. The deck still chokes out so many otherwise viable decks it's ridiculous.
And lastly the contrast between top legend players and the report is also worth mentioning. From what I see and hear, top legend is nothing but darkglare warlock mirrors and decks trying to counter it. Seems like it's oppressively strong, even more so than secret mage perhaps, but extremely difficult to play optimally.
Quote From SwizardIs it possible your hunter list is somehow better against them than the standard one or you are playing it better than most people? Based on vicious syndicate stats secret mage is highly favored but maybe most people misplay in that matchup. Any specific suggestions for how to play deathrattle hunter in that matchup or any cards you use different than their list?
I'm not really sure what the standard list is, to be honest. While VS has Deathrattle Hunter in their Tier list, they only provide a Secret Hunter decklist at the class section. So let's start with what I'm currently using:
Please note that I don't run Petting Zoo which ruins your Zul'jin turn. If you can provide me with another list I can try to explain any differences between them.
How to play against Secret Mage:
- We are the control deck in this matchup. No exceptions.
- The key to win this is that Secret Mage usually can't kill you with Fireballs and Cloud Princes alone. They need to go face. And we're good at preventing that once we've survived the early game.
- We should avoid procing Duplicate on their Kirin Tor Mage, Kabal Crystal Runner or Cloud Prince at any cost. Same goes for Occult Conjurer, this card is a real problem for us. Just kill smaller stuff first.
- Mulligan for Candleshot, secrets, Quick Shot, Grievous Bite. If you have two solid options, you can keep a value card like Master's Call, Barnes or Flark's Boom-Zooka. You can keep Rinling's Rifle as well, but be careful what you hit it with. If in doubt, go face and try to find an Explosive Trap, a Freezing Trap, a Misdirection or a Pressure Plate.
- Check for Counterspell before playing Nine Lives, Flark's Boom-Zooka or Jewel of N'Zoth. You can do this the turn before you want to play one of those cards. The best way to do this is by playing Carrion Studies, but I'd rather waste a Play Dead, a secret or anything else before running into that massive tempo loss of a Counterspell stopping one of your swing cards.
- Keep track of their secrets in general. Don't slam a low Health Deathrattle minion from Carrion Studies on the board if you suspect there's an Explosive Runes in play. Try to hit face every turn to deny them their Rigged Faire Game. You get the idea.
- There's some general advice in the guide to the deck, but this should get you started in this specific matchup.
All that said, I can't tell if I'm playing it better than most people, but I do have both Hunter and Mage over 1.000 wins and knowing both decks very well certainly helps. If you truly want to understand a certain deck in order to beat it more consistently, it usually pays off to try it out yourself. Good luck!
I play Wild Secret Mage on ladder (although a slightly different than meta list) to reach D5 since several seasons. I did not look up any stats but just based on my experience:
That being said there are several anti-secret tech tech cards available to slot into any deck. Just slot in a Secreat Eater if you are annoyed. Another tipp would be to just try to play around the secrets. I often have the impression people do not think enough and just shell out their cards.
English is not my native language, so please excuse occasional mistakes
Experience on D5+ is full of Secret Mage, Big Priest, Reno Priest, Odd Paladin. Similar to report.
Teching is overstimated. You can easily lose against Secret Mage despite playing Flare and Reno, since they simply vomit absurd amounts of Tempo while denying yours. You need equally absurd amounts of denyal to survive, and even racing them with Aggro is far from obvious.
Finally, even if you optimize against Secret Mage, your deck is still probably unfavoured against Big Priest and Reno Priest, with few exceptions.
Reno Priest itself is not far from being just as powerful (that is, a nearly flawless matchup spread) it's just less evident, and it's gonna be painful if they ever just nerf Secret Mage without touching Priest.
I'm not playing ladder again until next season or nerf.
I've been using Secret Mage to climb up through Diamond for the past year. Honestly, it's not my favorite deck to play, but it is efficient and relatively easy to create. I also love to play my Even Warlock and Highlander Priest decks, but I cannot plow through games as quickly with those since they are control decks and thus the games take a lot longer to play.
One thing I will say is that there was an article put out about an Anti-Secret Mage deck that just destroys it. It is meh against other decks, but just beats the hell out of Secret Mage. Like it isn't even funny how fast I conceded against that much hate.
Realistically, this deck is still MUCH slower than it used to be when it had Mana Wyrm. Granted, it now has the Occult Conjurer and Cloud Prince, the efficiency of the 1 mana drop 1/3 that just got bigger and bigger cannot be compared easily.
With all that being said... I have changed up my build substantially and my play style since I encounter a lot of Eater of Secrets and other secret hate... mostly coming from Rogue Shadowstepping Flik Skyshiv and just leaving me with limited burn.
Well since i'm still on Plat i really haven't seeing any secret mages whatsoever. My pocket meta is filled with Reno Priest, Big Priest, and aggro (and sometime random off meta deck) at the moment. Maybe those secret mages have already climb far above me.
Secret Mage is strong but far from unstoppable. It'll get eaten alive by anything that can out heal or build enough of a board presence they can't keep up.
Puts them unavored against Big & Reno Priest, Reno Lock, Reno Mage and Odd Paladin (if light on Flame Ward or if it omits Ice Block.)
This season, I started off piloting an aggresive Kingsbane Rogue list to Platinum and afterwards finished the climb to Legend using a Big Priest deck that has extra healing options (1x Greater Healing Potion and 1x Obsidian Statue). Unless I drew very badly, I had no problems with Secret Mage whatsoever. I know, it's probably considered bad manners, but I didn't even have to beat them down. I simply waited (pass the turn without roping) until they either concede or kill themselves since their damage output cannot handle my recurring healing and taunt capabilities. Ice Block was never an issue for me, it doesn't work anyways on their turn.
I had a bit more problems with Reno Priest though, because a lot of my opponents seemed to curve out the perfect card each turn, especially Lorekeeper Polkelt. To be honest, if only they removed this annoying card from the game, the dominance of Reno Priest is not that big of a deal to me. All other cases, where there was no perfect draw involved by them, I could pressure them enough to win this matchup. I even got a Tie! since that was the best they could get out of that particular match.
❄️THE END OF COVID-19 IS COMING ! ❄️
Quote From doingtheobvious Puts them unavored against Big & Reno Priest, Reno Lock, Reno Mage and Odd Paladin (if light on Flame Ward or if it omits Ice Block.)
Stats from report say otherwise. Look at the matchup spread.
Even assuming the report is somehow distorted, Secret Mage is not really as unfavoured against the decks you mentioned.
Statistics are just anecdotal in this context. No deck is unstoppable, against the lists I mentioned the best odds I'd give Secret Mage is a coin flip.
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