Hunter and Warrior Quests are Total Nerf Targets

United in Stormwind
  • FieselFitz's Avatar Prince Charming 1100 1355 Posts Joined 05/29/2019
    Posted 1 year ago

    Well so far i think the Warrior Quest is Fine as it is - Hunter on the Other hand looks a little too strong but maybe that only appeared to me because i play slower / kinda meme decks when i encountered those. 

    Haven't met a Mage, Paladin, Demon Hunter or Priest Quest yet so can't realy say anything about those. Druid seems ok but a little to inconsistent. Warlock looks decent but i ony met one and i won that Game. 

    Rogue is pretty decent but also only met 1 so far.

    But Warrior Questline does not - at least in my oppinion need a nerf ! Hunter - maybe ... 

    Challenge me ... when you're ready to duel a god!

    1
  • YourPrivateNightmare's Avatar Skeleton 1925 4197 Posts Joined 03/25/2019
    Posted 1 year ago

    So yeah, MAge Quest is completely busted unless you're playing full aggro. I have no idea how this shit got through playtesting but it absolutely needs to be nerfed into oblivion or else the game becomes unironically more unplayable than Day 1 Barrens.

    I tried having fun once.

    It was awful.

    1
  • dapperdog's Avatar Dragon Scholar 1670 4225 Posts Joined 07/29/2019
    Posted 1 year ago
    Quote From YourPrivateNightmare

    I'm genuinely worried that we might enter a Aggro vs. Quest meta with 0 control or value strategies.

    Currently no slow deck can outlast the Quest decks (at least not the playable ones). The only way to beat those (outside of a lucky Mutanus) is by abusing the fact that they are slow as balls and just rushing them down. Even that is not a guaranteed strategy because most of the effective quests can be completed around turn 8 or 9.

    I don't think any game with a long term plan that isn't a Quest deck can survive the onslaught and I fear we might need a bunch of nerfs to the quests just to make sure that Control remains a viable strategy.

    Kind feels like Un'goro, except every Quest class is Rogue.

    Probably still too early to call for nerfs, though Im very partial to seeing Incanter's Flow burning in hell.

    Quest decks are slow and will get slower as they adapt their game towards faster decks. The only decks that currently have a near guaranteed win against a traditional control deck would be questlock, mage, and priest. Nearly everyone else runs out of stuff at some point.

    Also, everyone is playing quest at the moment because its a shiny new toy. I'd imagine that in a week of two and we'll be seeing old midrange pally everywhere like we used to again. Then we can start dreaming of slower decks.

    1
  • YourPrivateNightmare's Avatar Skeleton 1925 4197 Posts Joined 03/25/2019
    Posted 1 year ago
    Quote From dapperdog
    Quote From YourPrivateNightmare

    I'm genuinely worried that we might enter a Aggro vs. Quest meta with 0 control or value strategies.

    Currently no slow deck can outlast the Quest decks (at least not the playable ones). The only way to beat those (outside of a lucky Mutanus) is by abusing the fact that they are slow as balls and just rushing them down. Even that is not a guaranteed strategy because most of the effective quests can be completed around turn 8 or 9.

    I don't think any game with a long term plan that isn't a Quest deck can survive the onslaught and I fear we might need a bunch of nerfs to the quests just to make sure that Control remains a viable strategy.

    Kind feels like Un'goro, except every Quest class is Rogue.

    Probably still too early to call for nerfs, though Im very partial to seeing Incanter's Flow burning in hell.

    Quest decks are slow and will get slower as they adapt their game towards faster decks. The only decks that currently have a near guaranteed win against a traditional control deck would be questlock, mage, and priest. Nearly everyone else runs out of stuff at some point.

    Also, everyone is playing quest at the moment because its a shiny new toy. I'd imagine that in a week of two and we'll be seeing old midrange pally everywhere like we used to again. Then we can start dreaming of slower decks.

    Yeah except Quest Mage wins by turn 8 without even having to jump through hoops. It can't run out of cards, it can't run out of damage and it gets 16 extra health.

    Questlock is the same but at least it has the decency to damage itself so you can try to race it.

    Quest Hunter is the "balanced" version which still kills you once the complete their quest but is more likely to actually run out of steam.

    Rogue is weaker but once Scabbs comes down you#re basically on a clock too unless you have removal for days (which is fine on paper, but once again enforces that you have to race it)

     

    Incanter's Flow isn't even the main problem anymore, Mage wins just as easily without it. Permanent +3 spell damage is broken in every scenario. It has to go down to +2 at the very least

    I tried having fun once.

    It was awful.

    0
  • dapperdog's Avatar Dragon Scholar 1670 4225 Posts Joined 07/29/2019
    Posted 1 year ago
    Quote From YourPrivateNightmare
    Show Spoiler
    Quote From dapperdog
    Quote From YourPrivateNightmare

    I'm genuinely worried that we might enter a Aggro vs. Quest meta with 0 control or value strategies.

    Currently no slow deck can outlast the Quest decks (at least not the playable ones). The only way to beat those (outside of a lucky Mutanus) is by abusing the fact that they are slow as balls and just rushing them down. Even that is not a guaranteed strategy because most of the effective quests can be completed around turn 8 or 9.

    I don't think any game with a long term plan that isn't a Quest deck can survive the onslaught and I fear we might need a bunch of nerfs to the quests just to make sure that Control remains a viable strategy.

    Kind feels like Un'goro, except every Quest class is Rogue.

    Probably still too early to call for nerfs, though Im very partial to seeing Incanter's Flow burning in hell.

    Quest decks are slow and will get slower as they adapt their game towards faster decks. The only decks that currently have a near guaranteed win against a traditional control deck would be questlock, mage, and priest. Nearly everyone else runs out of stuff at some point.

    Also, everyone is playing quest at the moment because its a shiny new toy. I'd imagine that in a week of two and we'll be seeing old midrange pally everywhere like we used to again. Then we can start dreaming of slower decks.

    Yeah except Quest Mage wins by turn 8 without even having to jump through hoops. It can't run out of cards, it can't run out of damage and it gets 16 extra health.

    Questlock is the same but at least it has the decency to damage itself so you can try to race it.

    Quest Hunter is the "balanced" version which still kills you once the complete their quest but is more likely to actually run out of steam.

    Rogue is weaker but once Scabbs comes down you#re basically on a clock too unless you have removal for days (which is fine on paper, but once again enforces that you have to race it)

     

    Incanter's Flow isn't even the main problem anymore, Mage wins just as easily without it. Permanent +3 spell damage is broken in every scenario. It has to go down to +2 at the very least

    I still dont get why people even bother with the quest in mage. The deck has to run stuff like Cone of Cold, Flurry (Rank 1), and Ice Barriers. They're even dropping Font of Power and Devolving Missiles these days. Once the meta turns outside of quests and minions start dropping on curve I doubt quest mage will still be able to do the same without dying.

    I'd much rather have a better chance at getting Incanter's Flow on 2 and just use the sheer power of cheap spells, Ignite, Fireball and Apexis Blast to win the game.

    Its too early to call for nerfs. Everyone is playing either quest or trying to cheat a few wins with the old meta face hunter and elemental shaman. I'd say give it a couple of weeks, and it'll be clearer what should be on top and what needs a little trimming.

    3
  • Hydrafrog's Avatar Gul'dan 1815 3125 Posts Joined 05/28/2019
    Posted 1 year ago

    Ok I have a few new opinions, but I think that The Demon Seed may get hit because it is incredibly reliable and almost spells doom in Wild.  I've been playing around with a "speed" deck that was posted and I went nearly 80% up to Diamond levels in about an hour of play.  

    It isn't unbeatable because you have to put SO much of your life on the line, but I can see the community complaining about it pretty hard.  Not as hard as the Stealer of Souls level, but it is pretty ridiculous. 

    As for Raid the Docks, I've been having so much fun with it in both Standard and Wild, but I think I may need to retract the statement of nerfing it because The Juggernaut can make it random enough to not break the game.

    On Defend the Dwarven District I threw in a few Voracious Readers and after I dropped Tavish, Master Marksman, I have enough spells in hand to keep it going until they are dead. When I used my tracker I was sitting at 75% with it.  The only thing that has been able to control that onslaught against them is my opponent nailed the reader immediately and/or had a TON of healing.

    1
  • anchorm4n's Avatar 1690 1873 Posts Joined 03/13/2019
    Posted 1 year ago

    I'm amazed by the impact the questlines have in wild. Warlock is strong but can be countered by Odd (Questline) Druid (!). Paladin is very solid as well, Hunter works well with Baku, Warrior has yet to decide if Aggro Pirate wants it but Odd is happy enough about some more infinite value. What I don't see at all is Mage, Rogue, Demon Hunter and Shaman. None of them feels oppressive in Wild levels of crazyness, even if Warlock comes close, but Odd Questline Druid gets an auto win against them. They basically erased the whole pre Stormwind meta with 3 or 4 legendaries :D

    I notice I am confused. Something I believe isn't true. How do I know what I think I know?
    Harry James Potter-Evans-Verres, hpmor.com

    3
  • YourPrivateNightmare's Avatar Skeleton 1925 4197 Posts Joined 03/25/2019
    Posted 1 year ago

    It appears Garrote Rogue has entered the competition to beat Mage for position of best single player deck.

     

    I honestly wouldn't be surprised if we get a hotfix nerf for both of those decks within a week. I don't think we've ever had a meta were combo decks are faster at killing you than the actual aggro decks.

    I tried having fun once.

    It was awful.

    2
  • dapperdog's Avatar Dragon Scholar 1670 4225 Posts Joined 07/29/2019
    Posted 1 year ago
    Quote From YourPrivateNightmare

    It appears Garrote Rogue has entered the competition to beat Mage for position of best single player deck.

     

    I honestly wouldn't be surprised if we get a hotfix nerf for both of those decks within a week. I don't think we've ever had a meta were combo decks are faster at killing you than the actual aggro decks.

    At least garrote may actually be a bug because the bleeds for some reason works with spell damage.

    1
  • Hydrafrog's Avatar Gul'dan 1815 3125 Posts Joined 05/28/2019
    Posted 1 year ago
    Quote From dapperdog
    Quote From YourPrivateNightmare

    It appears Garrote Rogue has entered the competition to beat Mage for position of best single player deck.

     

    I honestly wouldn't be surprised if we get a hotfix nerf for both of those decks within a week. I don't think we've ever had a meta were combo decks are faster at killing you than the actual aggro decks.

    At least garrote may actually be a bug because the bleeds for some reason works with spell damage.

    Well, it is technically a spell..

    3
  • Riffraff's Avatar 755 360 Posts Joined 04/30/2020
    Posted 1 year ago

    Here are my first impressions - similar to what some have already said. For what it's worth, I have ONLY played a super janky home-brew rogue list that is built with the sole purpose of completing achievements (mainly the unfun grind ones in the neutral cards section). As I complete an achievement, I swap out the relevant cards and replace them with "good" rogue cards. It's probably 3-40 so far since launch.

    The Mage quest seems REALLY strong. Before launch everyone was wondering in forums/streams "what kind of a deck wants to play fire/frost/arcane?". I guess we have the answer. I have seen the quest completed on curve, and then you get smacked in the face with their 9 damage Ignite and a couple of reduced cost fireballs on Turn 8 for the game.

    The Warlock quest also seems strong. The deck has ample healing and board clears (unless you have big SI:7 minions in stealth in my rare case).

    I have not seen the Paladin quest yet. Actually, only a couple paladins out there, period.

    The Hunter quest seems strong. There's a ton of burn in that deck, and upgrading the HP is pretty nuts.

    Priest quest - I saw someone play High Abbess Alura on 9 or 10  after dropping the quest reward (they completed on curve). And then they played the 0 mana heal both heroes spell to proc Alura and the Shard was cast from deck. I was impressed!

    Warrior quest - I played the VS list for the quest for 3 games right after the expansion. Seemed slow (in Standard).

    Have not played wild yet. It's hard to gauge what's the strongest thing out there given that I have been playing total garbage (and losing to pretty much everything), but so far it feels like Mage and Warlock are toughest. Honorable mention to the Garrote rogue list that runs Gadgetzan Auctioneer and can kill you on turn 8 as it draws through the entire deck.

    2
  • dapperdog's Avatar Dragon Scholar 1670 4225 Posts Joined 07/29/2019
    Posted 1 year ago
    Quote From Hydrafrog
    Quote From dapperdog
    Quote From YourPrivateNightmare

    It appears Garrote Rogue has entered the competition to beat Mage for position of best single player deck.

     

    I honestly wouldn't be surprised if we get a hotfix nerf for both of those decks within a week. I don't think we've ever had a meta were combo decks are faster at killing you than the actual aggro decks.

    At least garrote may actually be a bug because the bleeds for some reason works with spell damage.

    Well, it is technically a spell..

    The only two other examples I can think of thats damage done with the 'cast when drawn' mechanic, bombs and Iron Juggernauts burrowing mine, and those doesn't work with spell damage.

    1
  • linkblade91's Avatar Global Moderator Lissandra 1610 2012 Posts Joined 02/09/2019
    Posted 1 year ago
    Quote From dapperdog

    The only two other examples I can think of thats damage done with the 'cast when drawn' mechanic, bombs and Iron Juggernauts burrowing mine, and those doesn't work with spell damage.

    Pure speculation, but it could be because the bleeds come from drawing from your deck on your turn, whereas the bombs/mines come from your opponent's deck on your opponent's turn (generally speaking). Might be a coding quirk.

    If you have the time, you should totally check out our weekly Hearthstone card design competitions! :D

    2
  • YourPrivateNightmare's Avatar Skeleton 1925 4197 Posts Joined 03/25/2019
    Posted 1 year ago
    Quote From dapperdog
    Quote From YourPrivateNightmare

    It appears Garrote Rogue has entered the competition to beat Mage for position of best single player deck.

     

    I honestly wouldn't be surprised if we get a hotfix nerf for both of those decks within a week. I don't think we've ever had a meta were combo decks are faster at killing you than the actual aggro decks.

    At least garrote may actually be a bug because the bleeds for some reason works with spell damage.

    I think so too because I read on reddit that JAlexander said that the bleeds don't work with Spell Damage since that interaction had been removed back when Hakkar came out...but apparently Rogue doesn't care about the rules.

    Either way, I suspect that even without the bonus spell damage that deck still remains a festering cancer. It's just gonna draw through it's entire deck regardless and the spell damage shenanigans will help the burn spells in hand while Cloak of Shadows makes you practically invulnerable. Maybe Auctioneer should have been yeeted from the Core set altogether...

    I tried having fun once.

    It was awful.

    1
  • Hydrafrog's Avatar Gul'dan 1815 3125 Posts Joined 05/28/2019
    Posted 1 year ago
    Quote From dapperdog
    Quote From Hydrafrog
    Quote From dapperdog
    Quote From YourPrivateNightmare

    It appears Garrote Rogue has entered the competition to beat Mage for position of best single player deck.

     

    I honestly wouldn't be surprised if we get a hotfix nerf for both of those decks within a week. I don't think we've ever had a meta were combo decks are faster at killing you than the actual aggro decks.

    At least garrote may actually be a bug because the bleeds for some reason works with spell damage.

    Well, it is technically a spell..

    The only two other examples I can think of thats damage done with the 'cast when drawn' mechanic, bombs and Iron Juggernauts burrowing mine, and those doesn't work with spell damage.

    The issue there is that it is drawn out of their deck.  Since the bleeds from Garrote are drawn from your deck, it seems that any spell damage you have on deck will enhance those. 

    2
  • Hydrafrog's Avatar Gul'dan 1815 3125 Posts Joined 05/28/2019
    Posted 1 year ago

    Maybe I'm just lucky, but I've not seen any of the Garrote/Miracle Rogue decks in my plays.  I"ve encountered innumerable Mage, Warlock, Warrior, and Hunter quest decks, a few Priest, Druid, and Shaman, and not even a hint at the Demon Hunter or Paladin build in the slightest... which is kinda sad because I liked the idea of Paladin getting Silver Hand Recruit bonuses.  

    1
  • AbusingKel's Avatar HearthStationeer 785 290 Posts Joined 02/02/2019
    Posted 1 year ago
    Quote From YourPrivateNightmare
    Quote From dapperdog
    Quote From YourPrivateNightmare

    It appears Garrote Rogue has entered the competition to beat Mage for position of best single player deck.

     

    I honestly wouldn't be surprised if we get a hotfix nerf for both of those decks within a week. I don't think we've ever had a meta were combo decks are faster at killing you than the actual aggro decks.

    At least garrote may actually be a bug because the bleeds for some reason works with spell damage.

    I think so too because I read on reddit that JAlexander said that the bleeds don't work with Spell Damage since that interaction had been removed back when Hakkar came out...but apparently Rogue doesn't care about the rules.

    Either way, I suspect that even without the bonus spell damage that deck still remains a festering cancer. It's just gonna draw through it's entire deck regardless and the spell damage shenanigans will help the burn spells in hand while Cloak of Shadows makes you practically invulnerable. Maybe Auctioneer should have been yeeted from the Core set altogether...

    How awesome would it be if the dev team left it that way for class identity reasons? lol

     

    Mage & Warlock quest are the two that seem really awful. Lock has too much built in healing. Mage has too much burn for the combination of +3 spell damage AND cost reduction (yet again we see how bad Incanter's Flow is) to be healthy. 

    Hunter's quest seems good but not totally busted but it's still early. Rogue's quest is really fun and quite solid, but also not broken. I've been playing Rogue in standard and love it. Thankfully it's good there, since I tried it in Duels and it was terrible.

    I'm surprised I have not come across tons of token druid. I thought that would be a real pain in the ass with the tools that were added.

     

    Now you kids are probably saying to yourselves, "Hey Matt, how can we get back on the right track?" 

    1
  • Almaniarra's Avatar Devoted Outlander 880 1345 Posts Joined 03/21/2019
    Posted 1 year ago

    Deathrattle rogue rips quest mage apart. I played against mages 5 times and it was 5 win. Try it out.

    1
  • Hydrafrog's Avatar Gul'dan 1815 3125 Posts Joined 05/28/2019
    Posted 1 year ago

    Do you have a link for the deck?

    1
  • aposteljoe's Avatar COMMENT_COUNT_600_HS 1165 644 Posts Joined 06/18/2019
    Posted 1 year ago
    Quote From Hydrafrog

    So I cracked all my new United in Stormwind packs that I was able to amass from the gold I've been saving over the past month and crafted a few of the decks for the quests and I gotta say this... Hunter and Warrior are not only ridiculously easy to do, but probably NEED to be nerfed.

    I took the garden variety Dwarven Defense deck for Hunter with no changes and just ROFL stomped every single player I came across.  This works even more viciously in Wild with Baku.  I was able to accomplish it as soon as turn 6 and just destroy my opponent. 

    The Warrior quest was nearly almost as easy to complete.  Once The Juggernaut hits the board, it's kinda GG for your opponent.  I didn't even try to make a competitive deck, I just threw in some Pirates and Coerce into a deck and destroyed my opponents.  

    I've tried the Druid quest and it was lack luster to say the least but that was expected in the card reveal.  I got 2-4 of the other quests that I need to try as well, but honestly, I was shocked at how easy it was to just beat your opponent with the quest rewards of those two so far, so even though the Hunter quest is the ONE thing that has got me liking that class finally after the passed 7 years of playing this game, it really needs to be nerfed as it is waaaaaaaaaaaay too easy to complete.  Thoughts on this and your experiences so far?

    Are you still that opinion, OP? 

    -2
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