Renounce Warlock?

  • ArngrimUndying's Avatar Jaina 350 326 Posts Joined 06/11/2019
    Posted 2 months ago

    Perhaps I'm seriously misremebering, but for someone who joined HS well after Renounce Warlock was in Standard, I could have sworn seeing people talk from time to time about how good/strong/fun it was. Was that all in my imagination and the deck was always a hot mess?

    Trying it out today and whoo boy - aside from that 50% of the time I don't draw the card at all, the other 45% when I do play it delivers usually a trash fire of mismatched nonsense. I've seen some other people luck out some crazy synergies (one particular person had about 4 rush cards on top of a Spirit of the Rhino so nice for them), but in probably 10 games I don't think I've won a single one.

    Was there some secret to playing this deck in that past that I'm missing? 

    0
  • KANSAS's Avatar Wall 615 1009 Posts Joined 03/25/2019
    Posted 2 months ago

    it is just a bunch of random cards. so no, I don't think the deck was ever amazing, it is all just luck.

    1
  • iWatchUSleep's Avatar 375 456 Posts Joined 05/28/2019
    Posted 1 month, 4 weeks ago

    The only reason that deck won any games in the past was because of the stupid Barnes into Y'Shaarj, Rage Unbound combo. 

    Now that that doesn't exist anymore, Renounce warlock is just a meme deck, as it always should have been.

    4
  • AliRadicali's Avatar 400 623 Posts Joined 06/06/2019
    Posted 1 month, 4 weeks ago

    It's a trash-tier meme which is why I don't understand wasting a card slot on Renounce the Darkness for this event. A bunch of people jumped down my throat for being anti-fun or w/e for making similar comments in the reveal thread, but this is exactly the point I was getting at back then too: why waste people's time with unplayable "fun" cards when losing isn't fun and there are meme cards that actually pack a punch.

     

    -3
  • Zwane's Avatar Wizard 240 329 Posts Joined 06/04/2019
    Posted 1 month, 4 weeks ago

    I thought the idea was to give that card to your opponent and then play Unseen Saboteur

    1
  • FieselFitz's Avatar Anduin 345 325 Posts Joined 05/29/2019
    Posted 1 month, 4 weeks ago
    Quote From iWatchUSleep

    The only reason that deck won any games in the past was because of the stupid Barnes into Y'Shaarj, Rage Unbound combo. 

    Now that that doesn't exist anymore, Renounce warlock is just a meme deck, as it always should have been.

    like he said - the deck was mostly strong because of these 2 cards. 

    If you do not play with them it is simply a meme / fun deck !

    Challenge me ... when you're ready to duel a god!

    1
  • GameTheory345's Avatar Magma Rager 200 108 Posts Joined 05/29/2019
    Posted 1 month, 4 weeks ago
    Quote From AliRadicali

    It's a trash-tier meme which is why I don't understand wasting a card slot on Renounce the Darkness for this event. A bunch of people jumped down my throat for being anti-fun or w/e for making similar comments in the reveal thread, but this is exactly the point I was getting at back then too: why waste people's time with unplayable "fun" cards when losing isn't fun and there are meme cards that actually pack a punch.

     

    Different people have different goals when playing this game. I personally enjoy winning and climbing, so I play the best decks to rank up. Others don't like the standard meta but enjoy being competitive, so they'd play Wild or Arena. And some people have fun memeing with cards like Renounce. Different people are allowed to have fun in different ways, which is likely why you were being flamed. Nobody can tell you what's fun and not fun, if people enjoy memeing and don't mind losing, then good for them. I absolutely despise Highlander Mage and have a hilariously low winrate against the deck, while to others it's a complete meme. It's all based on perspective, you can't tell someone how they should percieve something.

    ???

    4
  • ArngrimUndying's Avatar Jaina 350 326 Posts Joined 06/11/2019
    Posted 1 month, 4 weeks ago

    AH! I did not know about the Barnes/Y'Shaarj thing - so that explains it. Thanks for clearing that up!

    I love a good RNG meme deck as much as the next guy (Burgle Rogue/Thief Priest are some of my favorite decks), but this was just too much - Renounce give you either a fantastically synergistic deck that allows for a steamroll (very rare) or you get a bunch of disjointed junk that gets you bodied (mostly this). I'll probably still kick it around between now and December, but man were my expectations way out off base with this one! 

    0
  • KANSAS's Avatar Wall 615 1009 Posts Joined 03/25/2019
    Posted 1 month, 4 weeks ago

    I think renounce darkness is a little funny because it is just like that one brawl everyone hates but your opponent still has a good deck.

    0
  • EndlessTides's Avatar 175 165 Posts Joined 03/25/2019
    Posted 1 month, 4 weeks ago

    I am memeing around at the moment with a Renounce Deck that does quite well. It has some early game drops for pressure, some Lackey generation for value, removal cards and some healing. I tend to play Renounce fairly late on and it's currently 6-3.

    ### Renounce This..
    # Class: Warlock
    # Format: Wild
    #
    # 2x (1) Call of the Void
    # 2x (1) Flame Imp
    # 2x (1) Mortal Coil
    # 2x (1) Sinister Deal
    # 2x (1) Soulfire
    # 1x (1) The Soularium
    # 2x (2) Dark Peddler
    # 2x (2) Defile
    # 2x (2) Gnomeferatu
    # 2x (2) Renounce Darkness
    # 2x (3) Drain Life
    # 2x (3) Shadow Bolt
    # 2x (4) Hellfire
    # 2x (5) Bane of Doom
    # 2x (6) Siphon Soul
    # 1x (8) Twisting Nether
    #
    AAEBAcn1AgLbBo+CAw4XkgeXB7YHzgfCCMQIzAjPFr2sAufLAq7NAqeYA/qkAwA=
    #
    # To use this deck, copy it to your clipboard and create a new deck in Hearthstone

     

     Forgot to say that this is Wild only.... Ignore me.. 

    Cocked, locked and ready to rock... 

    0
  • AliRadicali's Avatar 400 623 Posts Joined 06/06/2019
    Posted 1 month, 4 weeks ago
    Quote From GameTheory345
    Quote From AliRadicali

    It's a trash-tier meme which is why I don't understand wasting a card slot on Renounce the Darkness for this event. A bunch of people jumped down my throat for being anti-fun or w/e for making similar comments in the reveal thread, but this is exactly the point I was getting at back then too: why waste people's time with unplayable "fun" cards when losing isn't fun and there are meme cards that actually pack a punch.

     

    Different people have different goals when playing this game. I personally enjoy winning and climbing, so I play the best decks to rank up. Others don't like the standard meta but enjoy being competitive, so they'd play Wild or Arena. And some people have fun memeing with cards like Renounce. Different people are allowed to have fun in different ways, which is likely why you were being flamed. Nobody can tell you what's fun and not fun, if people enjoy memeing and don't mind losing, then good for them. I absolutely despise Highlander Mage and have a hilariously low winrate against the deck, while to others it's a complete meme. It's all based on perspective, you can't tell someone how they should percieve something.

    This is such a tiresome argument. Yes, individual differences exist. Yes, players prioritise different things. Yes fun is subjective.

     

    And yet, AND YET, somehow blizzard devs are able to come up with a general picture of what "fun" entails to most players and stick with it. It's no wonder that the latest version of Renounce the Darkness, Academic Espionage, is a hell of a lot stronger, not to mention more synergistic with the overall burgle rogue theme, resulting in a playable meme deck rather than a handful of random discounted class cards.

     

    The notion that it's impossible to generalise about what amounts to fun for most players of a specific game, just because someone, somewhere actively prefers losing to winning or w/e, is silly and obtuse. Your argument would have held more weight if you had made it on your own behalf rather than in name of some hypothetical player who may or may not exist.

    0
  • ArngrimUndying's Avatar Jaina 350 326 Posts Joined 06/11/2019
    Posted 1 month, 4 weeks ago
    Quote From AliRadicali

    The notion that it's impossible to generalise about what amounts to fun for most players of a specific game, just because someone, somewhere actively prefers losing to winning or w/e, is silly and obtuse. Your argument would have held more weight if you had made it on your own behalf rather than in name of some hypothetical player who may or may not exist.

    Hey now - there are dozens (DOZENS!) of us masochists out there who really love a good beating. That's right, Fireball me right in the face... 

    Image result for there are dozens of us gif

    Seriously though I agree - it's much more fun to have some RNG memes like Academic Espionage, Arch-Villain Rafaam,or Chameleos in an otherwise okay deck that generate unique, often hilarious wins than something that is a total "coin flip with a double-headed coin" where you're almost guaranteed to lose if the stars don't align for you. 

    1
  • AliRadicali's Avatar 400 623 Posts Joined 06/06/2019
    Posted 1 month, 4 weeks ago
    Quote From ArngrimUndying

    Seriously though I agree - it's much more fun to have some RNG memes like Academic Espionage, Arch-Villain Rafaam,or Chameleos in an otherwise okay deck that generate unique, often hilarious wins than something that is a total "coin flip with a double-headed coin" where you're almost guaranteed to lose if the stars don't align for you. 

    I think one reason I was so surprised and triggered by Renounce Darkness is that blizzard has gotten so much better in recent years at balancing these wacky random generation cards and making sure they actually have a home in (semi)-competitive hearthstone. I really enjoy the fact that HS lets us play cards that aren't in our starting deck, I think it's probably hearthstone's biggest advantage over say, Magic. I think Discover is the best mechanic in the game. Renounce the Darkness bothers me because it's such a step back from all of the progress we've made since it got printed, back to where you had unexciting tempo cards that won games on the one hand and useless meme cards on the other.

    I'm not saying they should have released Darkbomb instead, but at least with Lakkari Sacrifice you'd be able to build a deck around your meme.

    0
  • Zelgadis's Avatar 235 169 Posts Joined 05/29/2019
    Posted 1 month, 4 weeks ago
    Quote From Zwane

    I thought the idea was to give that card to your opponent and then play Unseen Saboteur

    I can't think of a practical way to do that, not even for a meme deck.

    You could play Lorewalker Cho, but then you have to play the spell before your opponent gets to. Of course you could tune your deck to come out better than an average deck would, but you'd still take a hit.

    You could put cards in your opponent's deck with Mischief Maker or King Togwaggle, but in the former case you'd have to get very lucky for that one card to be exactly Renounce Darkness and in the latter case it's hard to tell when the opponent drew it.

    If you can manage to get Renounce Darkness in your opponent's hand, you still need some luck for the Saboteur to cast it, since the opponent might be holding other spells. And even if you get lucky, unless Renounce Darkness is worded very poorly, it wouldn't do much unless your opponent also happens to be playing Warlock.

     

    1
  • ArngrimUndying's Avatar Jaina 350 326 Posts Joined 06/11/2019
    Posted 1 month, 4 weeks ago
    Quote From Zelgadis
    Quote From Zwane

    I thought the idea was to give that card to your opponent and then play Unseen Saboteur

    I can't think of a practical way to do that, not even for a meme deck.

    You could play Lorewalker Cho, but then you have to play the spell before your opponent gets to. Of course you could tune your deck to come out better than an average deck would, but you'd still take a hit.

    You could put cards in your opponent's deck with Mischief Maker or King Togwaggle, but in the former case you'd have to get very lucky for that one card to be exactly Renounce Darkness and in the latter case it's hard to tell when the opponent drew it.

    If you can manage to get Renounce Darkness in your opponent's hand, you still need some luck for the Saboteur to cast it, since the opponent might be holding other spells. And even if you get lucky, unless Renounce Darkness is worded very poorly, it wouldn't do much unless your opponent also happens to be playing Warlock.

     

    I love the synergy of you having Star Aligner as your avatar while pointing out how perfectly the stars would have to align for that idea to even be possible. Beautiful work; 11/10.

    0
  • KANSAS's Avatar Wall 615 1009 Posts Joined 03/25/2019
    Posted 1 month, 4 weeks ago
    Quote From EndlessTides

    I am memeing around at the moment with a Renounce Deck that does quite well. It has some early game drops for pressure, some Lackey generation for value, removal cards and some healing. I tend to play Renounce fairly late on and it's currently 6-3.

    ### Renounce This..
    # Class: Warlock
    # Format: Wild
    #
    # 2x (1) Call of the Void
    # 2x (1) Flame Imp
    # 2x (1) Mortal Coil
    # 2x (1) Sinister Deal
    # 2x (1) Soulfire
    # 1x (1) The Soularium
    # 2x (2) Dark Peddler
    # 2x (2) Defile
    # 2x (2) Gnomeferatu
    # 2x (2) Renounce Darkness
    # 2x (3) Drain Life
    # 2x (3) Shadow Bolt
    # 2x (4) Hellfire
    # 2x (5) Bane of Doom
    # 2x (6) Siphon Soul
    # 1x (8) Twisting Nether
    #
    AAEBAcn1AgLbBo+CAw4XkgeXB7YHzgfCCMQIzAjPFr2sAufLAq7NAqeYA/qkAwA=
    #
    # To use this deck, copy it to your clipboard and create a new deck in Hearthstone

     

     Forgot to say that this is Wild only.... Ignore me.. 

    why are you using Drain Life instead of Drain Soul? Unless you really need 2 face damage drain soul is just better.

    Also, soulfire seems like an odd inclusion here because discarding is usually not worth the extra damage.

    0
  • Synesthesy's Avatar 170 139 Posts Joined 05/28/2019
    Posted 1 month, 4 weeks ago

    Renounce Darkness is funny with Mecha-Jaraxxus that will say "DARKNESS DELETED!".

    However, I used to play it in a Reno Jackson deck as a last resort card, often after having played Lord Jaraxxus. Yes, it was quite a long time ago.

    Actually, the card can have a niche as a last resort card: when you have depleted your resources, play it hoping to get more resources. But the fact here is either A) you can build a warlock control deck with almost infinite resources, or B) your warlock deck will have a better win condition than this (Mecha'Thun, Rin, DK Gul'Dan...).

    I don't know how strong is warlock late game in standard, but if it isn't enough and the stars align, you could try this card.

    0
  • RandomGuy's Avatar 305 468 Posts Joined 05/29/2019
    Posted 1 month, 4 weeks ago
    Quote From ArngrimUndying

    Perhaps I'm seriously misremebering, but for someone who joined HS well after Renounce Warlock was in Standard, I could have sworn seeing people talk from time to time about how good/strong/fun it was. Was that all in my imagination and the deck was always a hot mess?

    Trying it out today and whoo boy - aside from that 50% of the time I don't draw the card at all, the other 45% when I do play it delivers usually a trash fire of mismatched nonsense. I've seen some other people luck out some crazy synergies (one particular person had about 4 rush cards on top of a Spirit of the Rhino so nice for them), but in probably 10 games I don't think I've won a single one.

    Was there some secret to playing this deck in that past that I'm missing? 

    It was your imagination. It was never good or strong. It only came close to like T5 status based wholly on the back of Barnes+Y'Shaarj

    It may have been "fun" I guess.

    0
  • Shosupply's Avatar 285 127 Posts Joined 05/28/2019
    Posted 1 month, 4 weeks ago

    Not to be off topic but what is your thumbnail a picture of @Synesthesy?  Reminds me of this D&D stick only comic.  Cant remember the name of it though.

    O, that this too too solid flesh would melt
    Thaw and resolve itself into a dew!

    0
  • clawz161's Avatar Mountain 235 135 Posts Joined 07/16/2019
    Posted 1 month, 4 weeks ago

    The problem you're having if you took a deck that you ALREADY KNEW was a RNG meme, and expected to enjoy playing it when you don't enjoy playing the game that way. I don't understand the reason for the thread tbh. Literally pikachu face meme, "I can't believe the random cards are bad" :O

    I am a chicken from the kitchen and I ain't kidding, although nothing is written.

    0
  • GameTheory345's Avatar Magma Rager 200 108 Posts Joined 05/29/2019
    Posted 1 month, 4 weeks ago
    Quote From clawz161

    The problem you're having if you took a deck that you ALREADY KNEW was a RNG meme, and expected to enjoy playing it when you don't enjoy playing the game that way. I don't understand the reason for the thread tbh. Literally pikachu face meme, "I can't believe the random cards are bad" :O

    This is exactly my point. If you're playing a meme deck and your goal is to win, you're not going to have fun. Playing an RNG meme deck is fun because of all the stupid stuff that can happen from playing it, not because you can win.

    ???

    0
  • AliRadicali's Avatar 400 623 Posts Joined 06/06/2019
    Posted 1 month, 4 weeks ago
    Quote From GameTheory345
    Quote From clawz161

    The problem you're having if you took a deck that you ALREADY KNEW was a RNG meme, and expected to enjoy playing it when you don't enjoy playing the game that way. I don't understand the reason for the thread tbh. Literally pikachu face meme, "I can't believe the random cards are bad" :O

    This is exactly my point. If you're playing a meme deck and your goal is to win, you're not going to have fun. Playing an RNG meme deck is fun because of all the stupid stuff that can happen from playing it, not because you can win.

    Being a fun wacky deck with lots of randomly generated cards isn't synonymous with being a bad deck. Burgle rogue, cyclone mage and quest shaman are or have been top competitive decks that rely *heavily* on randomness, discover effects etc.

     

    If you want to define "meme" as "unplayably bad" only to argue that unplayably bad decks are unplayably bad and people who enjoy winning should steer clear of "memes", congratulations on the tautology but you're clarifying exactly nothing there. Find me the people who are clamouring for a "fun" losing experience and I might take this argument a bit more seriously.

    1
  • Iplaywhite's Avatar Valeera 300 116 Posts Joined 06/10/2019
    Posted 1 month, 4 weeks ago

    It was bad "back in the day" and even worse now regretfully...they could update it to cards cost "2 less" to play and it still wouldn't be playable because deckbuilding requires synergies, end of.

     

    Even if you enjoy playing pure meme decks, presumably you throw synergy in your deckbuilding.

     

    "Soon we must all make the choice between what is right and what is easy"

    0
  • YJHS2000's Avatar Uther 255 112 Posts Joined 06/03/2019
    Posted 1 month, 4 weeks ago
    Quote From ArngrimUndying

    AH! I did not know about the Barnes/Y'Shaarj thing - so that explains it. Thanks for clearing that up!

    I love a good RNG meme deck as much as the next guy (Burgle Rogue/Thief Priest are some of my favorite decks), but this was just too much - Renounce give you either a fantastically synergistic deck that allows for a steamroll (very rare) or you get a bunch of disjointed junk that gets you bodied (mostly this). I'll probably still kick it around between now and December, but man were my expectations way out off base with this one! 

    Yep. I played this deck a bunch when it was new. It was fun, and had a respectable (not great) win rate, but most of my wins came via Barnes>Y'shaarj. Similar to the spell hunter that was around at that time. I said in another thread that I was really puzzled Blizzard chose this card for the event because it is really not good and Warlock is already in a bad spot. Either Blizzard is clueless or there is some Renounce unicorn deck nobody has discovered yet.

    Communism is just a red herring

    0
  • Synesthesy's Avatar 170 139 Posts Joined 05/28/2019
    Posted 1 month, 4 weeks ago
    Quote From Shosupply

    Not to be off topic but what is your thumbnail a picture of @Synesthesy?  Reminds me of this D&D stick only comic.  Cant remember the name of it though.

    The Order of the Stick. My avatar is a stereotipical Italian cleric of the FSM, courtesy of a image creator on that site.

    0
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