I haven't face a single Nox aggro deck since. And I admit I stopped playing mine. You think they overnerfed it?
Grenadier feels fine, being a 3/2 with upside is arguably a buff, gets to swing in and then latter deals 1 damage is a good aggressive card. However crimson disciple being a 2/3 with sometimes upside of doing 1 damage feels infinitely worse. Its possible you only run it in vlad decks now.
No they didn't overnerf it. The grenadier + transfusion + crimson disciple package was seeing play in nearly every aggro-oriented deck. The nerfs were justified and the deck is still serviceable.
Nox + bilgewater is a decent aggro deck. Problem is the only decks you face nowadays are sejuani/ashe and ezreal/tf cause no good players feels like innovating or playing at this point due to new cards being around the corner.
What I've seen happen, at least in Hearthstone, is that people give up on an archetype after a nerf because they think it's 'dead'. That may be because Blizzards usually obliterates their cards, though. Wait until a streamer of sorts makes a Noxus aggro deck and it'll be back.
The comunnity always overeact to nerfs. Noxus aggro is still fine, but it isn't a S tier deck anymore. Fewer people are playing that deck due to a factor i call: " The Snowball Nerf " effect.1- A given top tier deck gets nerfed so it becomes now a Tier A deck instead. 2- Top rank streamers will drop that deck to play the next top S tier deck.3- Many players will copy whatever their favorite streamer is playing or any new tier list available.4- As it drops further and further in popularity, more casual players drop it as well, perceiving it as a sign of weakness.5- The deck is then considered to be overnerfed just because no one is playing it.
Hearthstone: Me vs Firebat -> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=09NCE81owjo
Most of the noskills swapped to aggro stun/recall from what ive seen, 2 out of 3 matches in ranked is the same yasuo deck...
The developers said that they didn't want true aggro in the game, and thats very much what we have right now. While you can run elements of elusive, elements of aggro, or elements of burn you still need to have a solid midrange champ plan to go with it. I don't hate that, you can basically play what you want right now.
Errrrrrrr? 3-4 of the top aggro decks can kill you by turn 4-5 if you cant throw out small allies to block. And over half the people in ranked are running some form of aggro deck. The rest are the usual burn decks. There are very few midrange decks left other than that. I can go 10-15 matches without seeing a buff deck or a deep deck. Heck even I play Hecarim rush decks because the game is over by turn 5-6, whether I win or loose. That and its higher burst damage than most aggro decks can handle if you get 3-4 sharks rolling by turn 5.
Typically when I refer to midrange in Legends that is talking about the mana curve of a deck. So for example the old burn aggro or elusives didn't run creatures over 4 mana. Heckarim is six mana, so he is not an aggro card. This isn't mtg everything is creature or damage based to one extent or another it's just a question of how you get there. So yes every deck needs early drops, which is more in line with how hearthstone is played, unless you're playing another slow list and then open passing the first two rounds is fine.
Quote From PhaseshifterI haven't face a single Nox aggro deck since. And I admit I stopped playing mine. You think they overnerfed it?
I assume you're talking about the champion-less Noxus + P&Z deck which had been dominating the meta for months. Yes, I would say this patch finally pushed that specific deck below 50% winrate. I don't know that that qualifies as "overnerfing"--decks rise and fall below that waterline all the time, and the fact that particular decklist is largely unchanged since 1.0 is a big red flag. Really, I think this is just giving some other aggro decks like MF + Elusives and Discard some time to shine.
If you think Hecarim isnt aggro then you must not be using mana cheating! I usually play him on turn 5 or 6 with Oblivious Islander as long as he will level up. I mean 4 cost 9/6 onslaught that buffs your attackers by 3/0 is pretty aggro if you ask me. Also midrange is beating someone right before or at 10 mana. If they are dead at T5-6 that cant really be called midrange in ANY TCG.
Playing a 4 mana dead on attack heckarim doesn't seem amazing. It also would only happen in a very small number of hand states probably 1/20 statistically. That still doesn't make it an aggro deck.
When you play dozens of matches a day it happens pretty often. And who cares if hecarim dies if you won the match? I fail to see any logic to your last few posts other than writing "Nuh uh" in longer sentences. 4 mana for a 9/6 onslaught that generates 2 more 5/2s is the highest value card in the entire game. And that is not even counting your sharks that just spawned and became 6/1s or your very likely 1-2 soul shepherds that are out if you have no sharks which also buff hecarim and his adds. I very often have my opponent at 10-12 health by turn 4 just from them not wanting to block ephemeral attackers.
Quote From cheekyct When you play dozens of matches a day it happens pretty often. And who cares if hecarim dies if you won the match? I fail to see any logic to your last few posts other than writing "Nuh uh" in longer sentences. 4 mana for a 9/6 onslaught that generates 2 more 5/2s is the highest value card in the entire game. And that is not even counting your sharks that just spawned and became 6/1s or your very likely 1-2 soul shepherds that are out if you have no sharks which also buff hecarim and his adds. I very often have my opponent at 10-12 health by turn 4 just from them not wanting to block ephemeral attackers.
You should post your decklist, Cheeky. I just unlocked my 3rd Hecarim from the Spirit Blossom rewards and have been looking for some fun new decks for him.
It would only be a 9/6 leveled which played on curve on 4 as you stated is literally impossible, and if youre playing it off curve the mana discount is useless so which one is it? So no I won't humor your 2 percent of games scenario.
Quote From Nifty129It would only be a 9/6 leveled which played on curve on 4 as you stated is literally impossible, and if youre playing it off curve the mana discount is useless so which one is it? So no I won't humor your 2 percent of games scenario.
Apparently you need to reread my posts. You assumed "on curve" and I said turn 5-6. Hecarim is still 4 cost, but mainly so I can cast more ephemerals on the same turn. Note that I use Fading Memories to increase my shark or islander pools to 6 as needed. Its zero cost so isnt counted for that.
Cast order varies depending on if first. This is assuming Opponents don't feed their chump blockers to your ephemerals, which most surprisingly don't (they assume they can out-damage you with a big board), and that you go second in the round though it matters only slightly. Since Nifty insists its impossible I will also list maximum possible values though it averages to less if Op blocks.
Situation 1: Hecarim "on curve"
T1 - O. Islander on Hecarim Op HP =20. Hecarim = 0.
T2 - A shark + Islander Op HP = 15. Hecarim = 1
T3: A shark and then an Islander on Hecarim. Op hp = 15. Hecarim = 1
T4: Hecarim who is 2 cost less. Add his 2 summons and 2 sharks from earlier. Hecarim is only 5/5 as he only hits 6/7 counting himself. This is not ideal but its still puts the Op at zero hp if he doesn't have blockers by then, or pings off your ephemerals, which you REALLY want them to do after attacking. Show me ANY other deck in that game that can KO by turn 4. cuz I don't think even allies that get pumped by stuns and barrier can go up that quick.
Situation 2: Add an extra turn and go first so you can attack with Hecarim on 5.
T1 - O. Islander on Hecarim Op HP =18. Hecarim = 0.
T2 - A shark Op HP = 18. Hecarim = 0
T3: A shark and then an Islander on Hecarim. Add shark from T2. Op hp = 10. Hecarim = 2
T4: A shark, then usually I hold the mana for Glimpse Beyond for hand refill or even better, play a Soul Shepherd so Hecarims army is 1 bigger. Op HP = 10. Hecarim = 2
T5: Hecarim is now a 4 cost 9/6 Onslaught (or 10/7 with Shephard) and creates 2 tokens to completely fill your board with sharks and tokens as well as causing Hecarim to level up. Be sure not to play anything before attacking unless you absolutely have to. You now have up to 35 damage on board from minions, or up to 25 damage on board if Hecarim is blocked, depending on how much of his damage is soaked. It is EXTREMELY hard to live through that attack and usually the OP is forced to dump all their champs and allies to block or die. This same strat works if you were first, just mans you have to push back Hecarim to turn 6.
Obviously this deck is weak vs ping/recall/stun that happens before the attack, but what deck isn't? The fact that you have multiple cheap spells to pump out tokens means you can usually get n attack in every time your round happens even if they cc your first set.
As for deck list I have no idea how to show that sorry. Other than what is listed above I use darkwater scourges on defence turns to soak up attacks and pair them with Kalista so when she levels up she summons another scourge that also heals me each attack round. I keep rekindlers to replace the 2 champs if they die as well as pull off silly Kalista duplicating combos. I keep one Ruination as an ohshit button, and then Atrocities to finish off anyone low on hp who is able to block my souped up attack sharks. I make changes constantly but thats the basics.
Quote From cheekyctAs for deck list I have no idea how to show that sorry.
As for deck list I have no idea how to show that sorry.
Ok figured out how to post the code. This is a new variant im trying out. Its a tad slower but has better removal and more ways to get past blocking. On a highroll game I did 38 damage in one attack lol...
How dare you not to run at least 1 copy of The Harrowing in that deck :)Your list and gameplan look pretty solid on paper at least.
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