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duppie

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Joined 04/02/2019 Achieve Points 320 Posts 240

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  • duppie's Avatar
    HearthStationeer 320 240 Posts Joined 04/02/2019
    Posted 4 years, 7 months ago
    Quote From ArsArtis
    Quote From duppie
    Quote From ArsArtis
    Quote From duppie

    Yeah, I agree.  I think it's a cool and unique card and I like the way it is, but it's pretty strong. 

    Now that i've seen new expansion cards, It seems like the next expansion is giving standard more ways for more classes to deal with mountain giant+CC, so I think it will be fine without a nerf.

    Which ones? At the moment I have only seen the shaman plague and (maybe) the warlock plague. And shaman already had access to hex. Did I miss something?

     

    The warrior plague is probably good.  As warrior you often have some dudes on the board going into their first conj turn so you can trade some stuff and maybe even still have a board.  This card probably gives control warrior a less awful matchup against the deck because you aren't dependent on your two brawls always being there when you need them, and you might even slide one of these bad boys in bomb warrior, which cares about not destroying it's own board and being proactive.  

    The hunter secret seems solid and it makes giant + conj from hand leave them with one giant which is a lot easier to answer than two.

    Warlock plague is good as well as getting out a 5/5 and an 3/3 can stop them from giant and then conj the next turn, and holding cards in your hand for a big giant turn isn't something you can generally afford against aggressive warlock.  Warlock also has the big ass 7/5 that destroys a minion.  You don't mind taking 8 damage if you're killing a giant and denying a conj.  

    As for shaman, hex only hits one target so unless your shaman deck was very proactive they had no issue just holding cards to giant + cc on the same turn far before your hagatha's scheme.   plague of murlocs can even answer the huge khadgar boards.  

    Control Warrior didn't need to get a favorable match against mage as we could argue that mage was the only class keeping it in check and also it's still far from an unwinnable matchup. Not sure also how the plague may be more efficient of the current board clear as it's sometimes better and sometimes worse than a brawl and we need to see how the synergies works

    The hunter's secret is interesting, but not so great in other matchup. Still, the cc outvalues it as it has twinspell. Also, hunter decks already had favorable matchup against it and I don't know if the will add a situational card for a match for which they don't really need it

    The warlock plague is good as I also said, but I was thinking at the control warlock to combo with token creation. But control warlock has many others bad matchups and it's still looking for a strong formula. I will surely try the new cards with the Plot Twist warlock and see if they option other control options, but still too many cards are missing. Again, Zoo already has a very favorable matchup against mage and doesn't really need it

    The shaman plague, I've mentioned it. And of all the cards above is the card that can probably change an unfavorable matchup (30-40%) into a more favorable one. Still. luna's pocket and the shower of fireball/random spell could be too much. Also, control shaman as a problem against bomb warrior and swarm deck (where changing small minion into the same number of small minion doesn't improve the situation too much)

    The thing that can reduce the presence of CC Mages is the raise in strength or number of decks that by design are strong against it, because there is no tech cards between those revealed until now that help the classes in trouble against CC. And then it will become a situation like Big Priest, where the winning rates are under control but it feels awful to play against if they land their giant on 4 or Luna's on 5 and you're not one of those classeways tos that are the natural counter by design.

     

    I agree mage balances warrior by being such a strong check, but I would prefer warrior to get some kind of nerf and have the plague make this matchup a bit more balanced and have warrior a more balanced class overall.  And it's not that it's better than brawl, but it just gives control warrior a higher volume of clears to deal with more CC boards.

    The hunter card is the one i'm least sure of, but in the mentioned instance I don't think outvalueing with twinspell is relevant.  Spending six (or more) to giant + conj only to be left with one giant is bad tempo.  Then if that giant is cleared the mage is in a bad spot.  Midrange hunter is a good matchup for cyclone mage, but we're talking about ways to answer CC boards, which other potential hunter decks might not deal with as well.

    Control warlock is just bad, but this does give it an answer to a CC board where it only had twisting nether before.  Zoo warlock may be slightly favored over Conj mage but only slightly and it could still get blown out by certain hands that this plague gives potential answers to.

    Control shaman's weakness against other decks isn't what we're talking about though.  decks have bad matchups.  Control shaman can be a good matchup against conj mage.  Not sure about next expac, but in the current meta that would be huge.  

    I agree with the last point and that was something I was talking about too when I mentioned the other warlock cards.  I also think a secret/burn mage could pressure cyclone mage very hard.

  • duppie's Avatar
    HearthStationeer 320 240 Posts Joined 04/02/2019
    Posted 4 years, 7 months ago
    Quote From ArsArtis
    Quote From duppie

    Yeah, I agree.  I think it's a cool and unique card and I like the way it is, but it's pretty strong. 

    Now that i've seen new expansion cards, It seems like the next expansion is giving standard more ways for more classes to deal with mountain giant+CC, so I think it will be fine without a nerf.

    Which ones? At the moment I have only seen the shaman plague and (maybe) the warlock plague. And shaman already had access to hex. Did I miss something?

     

    The warrior plague is probably good.  As warrior you often have some dudes on the board going into their first conj turn so you can trade some stuff and maybe even still have a board.  This card probably gives control warrior a less awful matchup against the deck because you aren't dependent on your two brawls always being there when you need them, and you might even slide one of these bad boys in bomb warrior, which cares about not destroying it's own board and being proactive.  

    The hunter secret seems solid and it makes giant + conj from hand leave them with one giant which is a lot easier to answer than two.

    Warlock plague is good as well as getting out a 5/5 and an 3/3 can stop them from giant and then conj the next turn, and holding cards in your hand for a big giant turn isn't something you can generally afford against aggressive warlock.  Warlock also has the big ass 7/5 that destroys a minion.  You don't mind taking 8 damage if you're killing a giant and denying a conj.  

    As for shaman, hex only hits one target so unless your shaman deck was very proactive they had no issue just holding cards to giant + cc on the same turn far before your hagatha's scheme.   plague of murlocs can even answer the huge khadgar boards.  

  • duppie's Avatar
    HearthStationeer 320 240 Posts Joined 04/02/2019
    Posted 4 years, 8 months ago

    Yeah, I agree.  I think it's a cool and unique card and I like the way it is, but it's pretty strong. 

    Now that i've seen new expansion cards, It seems like the next expansion is giving standard more ways for more classes to deal with mountain giant+CC, so I think it will be fine without a nerf.

  • duppie's Avatar
    HearthStationeer 320 240 Posts Joined 04/02/2019
    Posted 4 years, 9 months ago
    Quote From nerfzul

    or just make conjuror's calling summon minions of the cost you ACTUALLY paid, meaning a 0 mana giant would summon two 0 cost minions.

    This is the real fix if T5 decides it needs fixing.  Conjurer's calling isn't even that strong on it's own, it just has powerful interactions with the giants because of mana cheating.  Conj on a minion you paid full price for is actually quite fair and cool design.   

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