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Too Much Is Not Enough - Card Design Competition Discussion Thread

Submitted 1 year, 10 months ago by

Competition Theme: Too Much Is Not Enough

Don't you just hate waste? Let's make sure our cards this week keep on giving until they can't give any more!

Chegwin is looking to indulge in a little excess this week - make sure your cards do too!

As always, I can be reached through Discord or here on the site via PM if you have any issues to report.

Competition Phases

Here are the phases of this card design competition

  • Submission Phase: Starts on Mon, May 30 17:00 EDT (GMT -0400). Runs until Sat, Jun 4 17:00 EDT (GMT -0400)
  • Voting Phase: Starts on Sat, Jun 4 17:00 EDT (GMT -0400). Runs until Sun, Jun 5 16:00 EDT (GMT -0400)
  • Finalist Phase: Starts on Sun, Jun 5 17:00 EDT (GMT -0400). Runs until Mon, Jun 6 17:00 EDT (GMT -0400)
  • Winner Selected: After finalist voting concludes and we validate votes.

Discussion Thread Rules

No thread rules were added to this season. Please populate and manually edit this thread with them.

  • ShadowsOfSense's Avatar
    1500 1111 Posts Joined 10/23/2018
    Posted 1 year, 10 months ago

    Competition Theme: Too Much Is Not Enough

    Don't you just hate waste? Let's make sure our cards this week keep on giving until they can't give any more!

    Chegwin is looking to indulge in a little excess this week - make sure your cards do too!

    As always, I can be reached through Discord or here on the site via PM if you have any issues to report.

    Competition Phases

    Here are the phases of this card design competition

    • Submission Phase: Starts on Mon, May 30 17:00 EDT (GMT -0400). Runs until Sat, Jun 4 17:00 EDT (GMT -0400)
    • Voting Phase: Starts on Sat, Jun 4 17:00 EDT (GMT -0400). Runs until Sun, Jun 5 16:00 EDT (GMT -0400)
    • Finalist Phase: Starts on Sun, Jun 5 17:00 EDT (GMT -0400). Runs until Mon, Jun 6 17:00 EDT (GMT -0400)
    • Winner Selected: After finalist voting concludes and we validate votes.

    Discussion Thread Rules

    No thread rules were added to this season. Please populate and manually edit this thread with them.

    Welcome to the site!

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  • Demonxz95's Avatar
    Senior Writer 2245 2630 Posts Joined 03/19/2019
    Posted 1 year, 10 months ago

    Do you feel the water and the wind carrying you forward?

    The effect will simply stop drawing cards once you reach your hand size limit, but will remember how many cards it still has left to draw, and when your hand has empty space, it will draw until you reach that amount.

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  • Wailor's Avatar
    Design Champion 640 707 Posts Joined 05/28/2019
    Posted 1 year, 10 months ago

    I'm satisfied with Allari's effect, but i struggle to find good cost and stats for it. Also, the art doesn't depict the actual character nor her signature scythe. I wonder if I should change the name, although the "Souleater" part of it fits her effect like a tea.

    About Spectacular Explosion, I'm not sure if the wording is the best.

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  • linkblade91's Avatar
    Senior Writer Serra Angel 1700 2782 Posts Joined 02/09/2019
    Posted 1 year, 10 months ago

    Is this too close to Rats of Extraordinary Size?

    Keywords include: Rush, Divine Shield, Taunt, Stealth, Lifesteal, Poisonous, and Windfury.

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  • AeroJulwin's Avatar
    Fan Creator 305 174 Posts Joined 07/08/2021
    Posted 1 year, 10 months ago

    2
  • anchorm4n's Avatar
    Toybox Tactician 1895 2316 Posts Joined 03/13/2019
    Posted 1 year, 10 months ago

    Something simple for starters. I know there's a clash with the name of the Paladin hero power, but it looks like that can't be helped in this case.

    I notice I am confused. Something I believe isn't true. How do I know what I think I know?
    Harry James Potter-Evans-Verres, hpmor.com

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  • AeroJulwin's Avatar
    Fan Creator 305 174 Posts Joined 07/08/2021
    Posted 1 year, 10 months ago

    Feedback

    First of all: insane coincidence! I had exactly three card ideas lying around that use the excess mechanic…

    the other two

    …What are the odds of that!?

    Demonxz95
    The mechanic is slightly unusual, but I'm mostly concerned about it being a very expensive card draw with no secondary effect. I like what you're going for, but those cards don't often perform very well. I could see it work with Wildheart Guff, but I'm hoping that won't become the norm.

    Wailor
    Spectacular Explosion is definitely better suited for Mage (rather than me trying to give it to a class that shouldn't have any AOE). I particularly like how it feels like an upgrade of Combustion. Comparing it to other AOE spells, I do think it would work better as a 4-Cost. I like Allari's effect a little better, it's very unique. But she doesn't seem as exciting to play.

    linkblade91
    It might use the same mechanic as Rats of Extraordinary Size, but I think it's still very much unique since it doesn't do anything with the excess tokens, but affects the ones that did fit instead. Its effect works very well, but I would prefer it as an 8-Cost and it should probably be a nature spell?

    anchorm4n
    The Silver Hand is kinda broken. 18 face damage is a lot and because of it, I'm afraid its effect won't see much use. It needs some big stat reductions, which would be a shame, so I recommend adding the "Can't attack heroes" instead. That way players would make a lot more use of its effect and since it's a Legendary, it can keep its stats.

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  • linkblade91's Avatar
    Senior Writer Serra Angel 1700 2782 Posts Joined 02/09/2019
    Posted 1 year, 10 months ago

    Here's Coral Cluster with the changes suggested by AeroJulwin, and some editing to the wording.

    Feedback:

    Show Spoiler

    anchorm4n - That is a lot of potential face damage, to the point where a deck might not even bother with the effect. I agree with the "Can't attack heroes" suggestion.

    AeroJulwin - Maybe it should say "Stores"? Just to clarify 100% what is storing the damage (the Guzzler). Also, while the art's subject is cool-looking, the white-ish blank background makes it look very unnatural for a card. I like the gameplay side, though.

    Wailor - Allari is ultimately a better Darius Crowley; personally, I don't find it compelling. It's more interesting than the spell, though. Sorry, that's not very helpful :/

    Demonxz95 - The extra overdraw-protection is neat, but I honestly don't think anyone would play such an expensive card that only draws. Maybe slash the draw and Cost down to make it more appealing?

    I feel I was quite negative, overall; apologies about that. I'm stressed about my job and super tired…

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  • Wailor's Avatar
    Design Champion 640 707 Posts Joined 05/28/2019
    Posted 1 year, 10 months ago

    Allari was generally perceived as boring, and I understand why. She's basically a minion with a basic keyword whose effect just gains stats, so I converted her into the rare Souldrinking Felbat.

    To compensate being able to run two, its stats are now 5/2 (and it's also a Demon). As a point of reference, overkilling a 1/1 would result in a 6/6 with the old statline, while the new one is limited to 5/5. Maybe a 6/1 statline, which would become a 6/5, would be a nice middle ground, but I don't like Rager-like statlines lol

    Finally, Deranged Shot gives Hunter a C'Thun card, which I believe the class was lacking. I had a hard time balancing the card, as the power level was much lower back then, especially for removal.

    Feedback:

    Demonxz95
    I like the effect, it's pretty original and goes around a pretty frustrating mechanic. People are probably right about it being too expensive, though.

    Besides this, I have some questions regarding to how this card interacts with other draw effects (and just with drawing at the beginning of the turn. Imagine you have 5 cards in your hand and use this. This would draw 5 cards and "remember" you still need to draw 3 more cards.

    • Now, at the beginning of your next turn, you draw one card. What would happen? Would the card draw simply not occur or would it be added to the remembered pending draws (adding to a total of 4).
    • Finally, when you draw all the "remembered" cards… Does the "cannot overdraw" effect still apply?

    linkblade91
    I wonder if this would work better as an Un'goro card, as the effect is pretty much Adapt (although the options are slightly different and the effects gained are completely random). Druid already has Living Mana in that expansion, so I don't know.

    Besides that, would the Coral Treants also be Beasts? It's a bit lame, but corals are technically animals so 🤷🏼‍♂️

    AeroJulwin
    Hands down the best idea so far, could easily win the comp. It has some things to polish, though.
    • The white background is quite ugly, and the creature depicted, while cool, looks like a Totem more than like an Elemental. So, I suggest finding a regular fire elemental.
    • The wording should say "stores" instead of "store".
    • Maybe it has too much face potential with Fire AoE, especially with stuff that also hits the Guzzler itself (not sure if it exists right now). I don't know, I'd probably change it to target enemy minions only, but that might be too weak.

    anchorm4n
    The stats are definitely very strong for a 4 mana weapon, so I'd make the change AeroJulwin proposed.

    Besides this, I'm not sure if the effect is a bit too simple for a legendary weapon, given it's basically a weaker version of Lifesteal. Maybe the fat stats make it such a strong control tool that the legendary status is warranted, I don't know.

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  • anchorm4n's Avatar
    Toybox Tactician 1895 2316 Posts Joined 03/13/2019
    Posted 1 year, 10 months ago

    Meh, guess my card is overpowered and boring at the same time. I'll see if I find the time to think of something else. Thanks for all your feedback, here are my thoughts on your cards:

    Wailor
    I really like the flavor of the new Souldrinker, but I'm not a big fan of the art as it's Demon Hunter's WoW mount art (which has another name) if I remember correctly and it's just too dark and too detailed to look good on top of that. Balancing the stats of this one is super tricky, you've done a good job of it as far as I can tell though. The C'Thun alternative is a cool idea as well, but I'd up the damage to make it more worth the Mana (like 6 damage or something).

    linkblade91
    Nice flavor, very fitting for the new expansion. I could see this being printed actually, it has just the right amount of randomness for its cost. Fair warning: I might give you only 4 stars if you don't add a token.

    AeroJulwin
    Very cool idea, even if it looks a little complicated for a 1 drop. I really don't like the art though and agree with linkblade about the spelling ("Stores").

    Demonxz95
    An interesting idea, new mechanics are always exciting. I have to agree with much of the other's feedback though, even with Druid's ways to ramp and Mana Cheat this might be too expensive. Maybe you could reduce the cost and the number of cards drawn or put it on a stick (probably too close to Octosari, meh) or do something similar to Cannonmaster Smythe and transform all excess cards into treants?

    I notice I am confused. Something I believe isn't true. How do I know what I think I know?
    Harry James Potter-Evans-Verres, hpmor.com

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  • Demonxz95's Avatar
    Senior Writer 2245 2630 Posts Joined 03/19/2019
    Posted 1 year, 10 months ago

    I've had some time taken up. Let's just say that I've been working on a project for a while, and I'll give you a little teaser in the spoiler below.

    Show Spoiler

    More on that will be revealed later...

    In response to my card's feedback, I must admit that I do like the Treant-summoning idea. I'll see if I can make it work on the card*. Here's my thoughts on everything so far:

    Wailor
    I do prefer Spectacular Explosion over Allari the Souleater, and I think the wording on it is fine. I do think Allari looks better in her Rare-Demon form too. Deranged Shot is neat, but unfortunately the rate in which you deal damage versus buff C'Thun is incredibly weak.

    Linkblade91
    I like it. I do think "Keywords" is something Hearthstone will use like this someday (if what I'm saying makes sense). I think this looks pretty good. I remember The Forest's Aid being pretty good, and this kinda looks like that, so it seems quite solid to me.

    AeroJulwin
    A really cool idea (though I must also agree about the wording), and I do think it needs better artwork.

    Anchorm4n
    I unfortunately must agree that your card is both overpowered and not particularly compelling, but I think it can absolutely be worked into something better.

    *I'm now finding that the idea is extremely similar to Link's card. Both would be 8 mana Epic Druid spells that summon Treants based on an excess quantity of some other entity.

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  • anchorm4n's Avatar
    Toybox Tactician 1895 2316 Posts Joined 03/13/2019
    Posted 1 year, 10 months ago

    Thanks for your kind words, Demon. You actually made me think of something, but I could use some help with the wording since there's no precedence. How would you phrase a buff per excess damage effect? Like if you deal 3 excess damage, you buff by +3/+3. Something like this?

    I notice I am confused. Something I believe isn't true. How do I know what I think I know?
    Harry James Potter-Evans-Verres, hpmor.com

    1
  • Wailor's Avatar
    Design Champion 640 707 Posts Joined 05/28/2019
    Posted 1 year, 10 months ago
    Show Spoiler
    Content
    Quote From anchorm4n

    Thanks for your kind words, Demon. You actually made me think of something, but I could use some help with the wording since there's no precedence. How would you phrase a buff per excess damage effect? Like if you deal 3 excess damage, you buff by +3/+3. Something like this?

    I like the new direction of this card. It's a very interesting effect, and makes a lot of sense given the name of the card.

    However, being able to give your minions +5/+5 across the board makes it way too strong. I'd probably nerf it to 4/3; or even 3/3 or 4/2 while also giving up the "Can't attack heroes" part.

    Also, the proper plural of hero is heroes (not heros), and it shouldn't be formatted in italics, if you decide to keep that part.

    Finally, about the wording, I'd use "After you attack and kill a minion, give your Silver Hand Recruits stats equal to the excess damage.", but the wording you used also works I think.

    All in all, good job with the card! Sorry if I sounded too harsh in my previous comment. I really didn't mean to sound overly negative, I just tried to focus in the parts that could be improved.

    1
  • anchorm4n's Avatar
    Toybox Tactician 1895 2316 Posts Joined 03/13/2019
    Posted 1 year, 10 months ago

    Thanks for your help! I know I'll have to take a second look at balance and execution (spelling error, italic text...), I just wanted to hear your thoughts about the wording of the buffing effect and quickly posted right before dozing off last night :)

    I notice I am confused. Something I believe isn't true. How do I know what I think I know?
    Harry James Potter-Evans-Verres, hpmor.com

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  • daybreaks's Avatar
    45 3 Posts Joined 03/15/2021
    Posted 1 year, 10 months ago

    Can I get some feedback. Really new at this. Not sure quite how to balance it. I personally think it's overcosted and maybe should be 6 mana, possibly 5. At healing 1 damage its slightly better than flamestrike, but your not really benefiting from a heal then. In the middle, you can heal a minion for 3 and get an old flamestrike. I don't know.

     

    Holy Radiance

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  • BasilAnguis's Avatar
    Dragon Scholar 835 421 Posts Joined 05/29/2019
    Posted 1 year, 10 months ago

    Many exams, sorry for low engagement from me.

    If you have 7 cards in hand, you gain 3 coins and summon a 7 cost dragon. If you have 2 cards in hand you get 8 coins and summon a 2 cost dragon.

    I'll boop you 

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  • AeroJulwin's Avatar
    Fan Creator 305 174 Posts Joined 07/08/2021
    Posted 1 year, 10 months ago

    More Feedback

    linkblade91
    I think this could very well win the competition. Good luck!

    Wailor
    I still like Spectacular Explosion and Souldrinking Felbat is a good alternative. I don't know anything about C'thun balance, but Deranged Shot doesn't seem as exciting

    anchorm4n
    I like the new effect. It's very fitting and can be very effective. Balance-wise I recommend 4/2 stats or 4/3 with "Can't attack heroes."

    daybreaks
    This looks great. The effect is particularly well thought-out. Balance is though, because it's dependant on the state of the board. I think I like 6 Mana best. Don't forget to make it a Holy spell. And besides that my only concern is that the expansion doesn't quite fit.

    BasilAnguis
    The text is a little small, although that might be becoming acceptable for legendaries. The Coins do seem better than the dragon most of the time. I could see a few archetypes that might want to make use of this, although I wouldn't know how to balance it.

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  • Demonxz95's Avatar
    Senior Writer 2245 2630 Posts Joined 03/19/2019
    Posted 1 year, 10 months ago

    Much simpler idea this time around. When one's death is not killed in honor, the light gives them a second chance.

    More feedback:

    Anchorm4n
    I like this new place you've taken the card. However, I do agree with Wailor about everything. If you can fix all this up, then you'd have yourself a pretty strong contender in my opinion.

    Daybreaks
    Welcome aboard. Hope you enjoy yourself. If you ever have any questions, then please feel absolutely free to ask.

    My main two criticisms of the card are the fact that Paladins don't normally get large board clears like this, as well as fact that it doesn't feel like a VttSC card. Paladin does very occasionally get a small board clear here and there, but when it comes to large minions, their way of dealing them with is to lower their stats and then attack them rather than outright destroying them. As AeroJulwin said, do be sure to remember the Holy spell tag.

    BasilAnguis

    The first thing I notice is that the name is already taken by Dragon's Hoard, so you should change that when you can.

    It's certainly interesting. I do think it can hurt you because if your opponent kills it on their turn (and then they would presumably also kill the Dragon if they do this), then you're guaranteed to burn a card. I don't really think there's a way to avoid that though. My first instinct is to say that balance is probably okay, but I can't really say for sure.

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  • anchorm4n's Avatar
    Toybox Tactician 1895 2316 Posts Joined 03/13/2019
    Posted 1 year, 10 months ago

    Some late feedback:

    Demonxz95
    I'm a bit torn on this one. I like the flavor you're aiming at, but it feels a little forced not to use Honorable Kill since the effect is already in the game with Korrak the Bloodrager. Some might consider it a power crept Redemption but I think there are enough differences between the cards to go with it. Finally, the art is a little on the edge of what HS should look like for me. I'd rather expect this on a Runeterra card I guess? So all in all I totally get why you don't want to submit a card that's similar to linkblade's but I still like your initial idea much more.

    BasilAnguis
    I really like the flavor! The facts that it's a 5 Mana do nothing and that you will burn a card more often than not when the Deathrattle goes off lead me to think it might even be okay as an Epic. Make sure to change the watermark (and the name) before you submit!

    daybreaks
    Hey there, welcome to this part of OOC! Very nice idea you brought out as your first contribution. I do agree with Demon though, big AOE wouldn't fit Paladin's class identity very well. That can easily be fixed by reducing the amount of Health that gets restored though (which in turn would make a change of the cost necessary). As the others have already pointed out, don't forget about the spell school tag and if in doubt, always go with a custom watermark. Good luck in your first competition!

    I notice I am confused. Something I believe isn't true. How do I know what I think I know?
    Harry James Potter-Evans-Verres, hpmor.com

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  • Wailor's Avatar
    Design Champion 640 707 Posts Joined 05/28/2019
    Posted 1 year, 10 months ago
    Quote From daybreaks

    Can I get some feedback. Really new at this. Not sure quite how to balance it. I personally think it's overcosted and maybe should be 6 mana, possibly 5. At healing 1 damage its slightly better than flamestrike, but your not really benefiting from a heal then. In the middle, you can heal a minion for 3 and get an old flamestrike. I don't know.

     

    Holy Radiance

    Welcome to fan creations!

    I like this card a lot, but I agree with other people that it doesn't fit the Paladin class. Instead of reworking the card, I'd simply move it to Priest, as it's a class with very strong AoE like this.

    About the Mana cost, I think you could reduce it to 6 like you proposed, but make sure to include the Holy school tag.

    Sorry for not giving feedback to the rest of you, it's been a busy couple of days.

    1
  • Demonxz95's Avatar
    Senior Writer 2245 2630 Posts Joined 03/19/2019
    Posted 1 year, 10 months ago

    I can't exactly say I'm excited about submitting the original Superflow unchanged after the original wave of feedback I got, but the fact of the matter is that I absolutely couldn't get anything else that I thought was OK (other than that Paladin Secret), and I was also so incredibly occupied with my new custom set that it never even crossed my mind.

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  • AeroJulwin's Avatar
    Fan Creator 305 174 Posts Joined 07/08/2021
    Posted 1 year, 10 months ago

    Don't forget to submit! There's only a few hours left.

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  • linkblade91's Avatar
    Senior Writer Serra Angel 1700 2782 Posts Joined 02/09/2019
    Posted 1 year, 10 months ago

    Good luck to the finalists!

    1
  • linkblade91's Avatar
    Senior Writer Serra Angel 1700 2782 Posts Joined 02/09/2019
    Posted 1 year, 10 months ago

    Congratulations to RenoLord

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  • anchorm4n's Avatar
    Toybox Tactician 1895 2316 Posts Joined 03/13/2019
    Posted 1 year, 10 months ago

    Congrats to RenoLord!

    I notice I am confused. Something I believe isn't true. How do I know what I think I know?
    Harry James Potter-Evans-Verres, hpmor.com

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  • Wailor's Avatar
    Design Champion 640 707 Posts Joined 05/28/2019
    Posted 1 year, 10 months ago

    Congrats! Very well deserved win :)

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