Lost In Battle - Card Design Competition Discussion Thread

  • ShadowsOfSense's Avatar Senior Moderator 1500 1110 Posts Joined 10/23/2018
    Posted 1 year, 3 months ago


    Competition Theme: Lost In Battle

    Mankrik isn't the only one capable of sending people on Quests - let's see what else we can do here!

    • You must create a Quest or Sidequest for the Forged in the Barrens expansion
      • That's the Quest mechanic - like The Last Kaleidosaur - but with an appropriately Barrens themed requirement and reward

    MathU is sending us off to the Barrens to seek out some Quests - hopefully they'll be easier to find than poor Olgra!

    As always, I can be reached through Discord or here on the site via PM if you have any issues to report.


    Competition Phases

    Here are the phases of this card design competition

    • Submission Phase: Starts on Mon, Jun 21 17:00 EDT (GMT -0400). Runs until Sat, Jun 26 17:00 EDT (GMT -0400)
    • Voting Phase: Starts on Sat, Jun 26 17:00 EDT (GMT -0400). Runs until Sun, Jun 27 16:00 EDT (GMT -0400)
    • Finalist Phase: Starts on Sun, Jun 27 17:00 EDT (GMT -0400). Runs until Mon, Jun 28 17:00 EDT (GMT -0400)
    • Winner Selected: After finalist voting concludes and we validate votes.

    Discussion Thread Rules

    No thread rules were added to this season. Please populate and manually edit this thread with them.

    Welcome to the site!

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  • Hordaki's Avatar Dragon Scholar 650 264 Posts Joined 05/28/2019
    Posted 1 year, 3 months ago

    I guess I'll kick this off. This quest tries to combine all of the main Barrens Mage mechanics into one quest: spell schools, Hero Power synergy, and freeze synergy.

          -Hordaki (rhymes with Mordecai)

           Check out the Tactician custom class!

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  • Demonxz95's Avatar Content Squad 2120 2207 Posts Joined 03/19/2019
    Posted 1 year, 3 months ago

    The Priest's duality is their light and their shadow co-existing. This card represents both sides of Priest.

    A Quest with two requirements is something I've wanted to play around with, and I may have just found the perfect time. Whichever Hero Power you get first depends on which part of the requirement is fulfilled last. Fulfilling the Holy part last will give you Holy Beam first, whereas fulfilling the Shadow part last will give you Shadow Beam first. At the start of your turn, you can choose which of these two Hero Powers you want for that turn.

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  • linkblade91's Avatar Global Moderator 1610 2072 Posts Joined 02/09/2019
    Posted 1 year, 3 months ago

    I chose the OG route of being rewarded an actual card, instead of a Hero Power. It's ultimately a cheaper, better Silver Sword in a class that wants it more. Edit: The Horn could maybe stand to be more original. I'm happy with the Quest part.

    If you have the time, you should totally check out our weekly Hearthstone card design competitions! :D

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  • BloodMefist's Avatar Content Squad Old God Fanatic 825 722 Posts Joined 05/28/2019
    Posted 1 year, 3 months ago

    Hoppin back in here in hopes of re-integrating myself into the fan creation community a bit more and winning through the power of constructive feedback!

    Bring the End is the Horde quest in which players must defeat Amnennar, the Coldbringer, the final boss of Razorfen Downs, and retrieve his skull. I was a tad disappointed to see that some of the other bosses, like Mordresh Fire Eye and Plaguemaw the Rotting, got representation while the final boss isn't seen at all. 

    Balance/design-wise, I really like the idea of helping deck-destruction Warlock along, but am a bit worried that the quest is too easy to complete thanks to the existence of Altar of Fire. Increasing the requirement makes it so that you can't complete the Quest on turn 2, but also makes Altar very mandatory. I've thought about changing the requirement to "Destroy 20 cards" so that its more widely accessible while still synergizing with deck-destruction cards.

    As for the rewards, the healing one helps Warlock a lot in alleviating the harm of their own effects as well as Fatigue, which I think it fine considering you lose the best base hero power in the game. While the second has infinite value on a discover effect seems scary too, the pool of cards you destroy will only increase as the game goes on an can be filled with some garbage if you burn situational cards from your opponent or destroy their tokens. I think that both fit the 'Lich' flavor pretty well though.

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  • Wailor's Avatar Design Champion 555 591 Posts Joined 05/28/2019
    Posted 1 year, 3 months ago

    Since Demon Hunter never received a Quest, I thought it'd be interesting to explore what it could get.

    Edit: Changed it to a 6/6 (up from 5/5) so that it has the same stats as its Battlegrounds counterpart.

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  • Lundy's Avatar Little Devil Teemo 1555 700 Posts Joined 06/21/2019
    Posted 1 year, 3 months ago

    I have several other ideas for this prompt, but these were the more Barrens relevant ones. They need some tuning and wording tweaks yet.

    Ritual of Summoning: I really wanted to make it Paladin specific but it would have to have a high summon requirement as Party Up! just completes it otherwise. Neutral was considered, but couldn't balance making it a deckbuilding challenge for some classes and a breeze for Paladin.

    Embrace Insanity: Continuing the Fatigue Warlock that was pushed in Barrens, along with a call back to Archivist Elysiana. Possible name change to Archwitch Elysiana to be more on theme with Warlocks and Demons.

    Lost in the Barrens: On theme of Barrens in both art and mechanics, as it pushes with Warrior Frenzy archetype further in a very simple way.

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  • R's Avatar Design Champion 990 721 Posts Joined 04/23/2020
    Posted 1 year, 3 months ago

    I think that I miss something somewhat important... Also I can't find a good name to it.

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  • anchorm4n's Avatar 1690 1881 Posts Joined 03/13/2019
    Posted 1 year, 3 months ago

    This theme is super hard for me. Here is what I've got so far. Are 5 cards enough? Coin into Foxy Fraud into Swindle into Shadowstep into Foxy Fraud into whatever is pretty easy on paper and there's also Backstab, but you'd dump pretty much your whole hand for this, so I think it's fair. Should the Hero Power cost 1 or 2? Any suggestions for better names?

    I'll probably give feedback tomorrow, lots of RL stuff to do again :(

     

    I notice I am confused. Something I believe isn't true. How do I know what I think I know?
    Harry James Potter-Evans-Verres, hpmor.com

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  • KANSAS's Avatar Old God Fanatic 1745 2912 Posts Joined 03/25/2019
    Posted 1 year, 3 months ago

    Feedback:

    Hordaki:

    Show Spoiler
    I like having a quest use spell schools, but at 7 frost feels like a lot for the payoff. I would either make the hero power better, or reduce the requirement to 4-5 spells.

    Demonxz95:

    Show Spoiler
    I can understand why you have the player choose each hero power, but for the sake of simplicity and continuity I would just have it pick a random power when it transforms and switch back and forth on each use. Other than that I really like it.

    linkblade91: 

    Show Spoiler
    I agree that the reward could be more interesting. I really like the first half though. Maybe the payoff could be a passive effect (either in the form of a hero power or weapon) that gave all minions you summoned without playing +1/+1. Or something like that.

    BloodMefist:

    Show Spoiler
    I love the idea of a quest to help out deck destruction warlock. I don't like the idea of changing it to just "destroy 20 cards" since that feels too generic. In terms of the reward, the passive one doesn't really feel connected with the quest. So I would definitely go with the second one.

    Wailor:

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    The first half feels too similar to the priest quest, and the second half is literally just The Undertaker with rush. It isn't a bad quest, but the reward could be more unique.

    Lundy:

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    Lost in the Barrens: First off you need art for the hero power, and also don't forget to add "Passive Hero Power" to the hero power. I might change the reward to make it a little more interesting, but I think it is fine as it is.

    Embrace Insanity: I like the idea of this one, but the execution leaves much to be desired. First off the reward comes off rather late in the game, meaning that the majority of the time it is just a wasted slot in your deck. But also the reward isn't really worth it. You increase your deck by 5 cards, but people can already run Envoy Rustwix and the Prime. 

    Ritual of Summoning: This one is my least favorite. I don't think an adventure themed deck would really work out mechanically. Most of the cards that summon you adventurers are pretty mediocre, and the reward for summoning all of those mediocre 2/2s is a bunch more mediocre 2/2s. It's a cool idea, but I don't think it would make a very interesting deck.

    All in all I think lost in the barrens is your best card.

    R:

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    Honestly the quest isn't that interesting. You have to play three cards and you are rewarded with infinite value. I think what you are missing is some kind of deck building restriction or some kind of direction to take your deck in. Right now you just have to play a few cards that you would probably already be running anyways, but a quest should make you run cards you wouldn't normally run to get a cool benefit.

    anchorm4n:

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    I like the first half since the flavor is on point and the difficulty feels just right. However, the hero power is pretty scary. Rogues are already notorious for cheating mana and playing a ridiculous number of cards in a turn, getting that many coins will likely be a major point of frustration for the opponent.

    Carrion, my wayward grub.

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  • Wailor's Avatar Design Champion 555 591 Posts Joined 05/28/2019
    Posted 1 year, 3 months ago

    Improved version of my Quest (mostly aesthetic changes) + a new iteration with a Hero Power reward.

    Feedback time:

    Hordaki

    Show Spoiler
    I feel like the reward isn't too good for the amount of spells you need to cast. I'd either reduce it to 4-5 or improve the damage of the HP to 2.

    Otherwise, pretty straightforward but nice card. The usage of the spell Schools and the troll artwork makes it feel very Barrens.

    Demonxz95

    Show Spoiler
    Probably my favorite so far. Dual Priest cards are always cool, and yours is executed in a way that makes a lot of sense.

    linkblade91

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    Druid has a lot of token cards, for sure, but it doesn't seem to be its main focus in Barrens. I don't know, maybe people won't care because at least the reward is tied to the Barrens flavor-wise.

    BloodMefist

    Show Spoiler
    It's a bit of a weird requirement, because instead of needing a lot of cards to complete it, you might just need 2 very specific ones (like two Altar of Fire, for instance). I think this would make the Quest a bit RNG reliant, but I'm not sure how much of a problem this is.

    Regarding the rewards, I prefer the one that isn't Passive, because it's tied to the Quest requirement.

    Lundy

    Show Spoiler
    All three are quite cool.

    • Lost in the Barrens, while simple, fits Warrior very well. The artwork needs to be better, though.
    • Embrace Insanity is cool, even if the fact that Quests start in your hand might actually hinder it (since it's a card you'd rather draw last).
    • I don't know if Ritual of Summoning is allowed (since it's from Wailing Caverns and not from Barrens), but if it can, it's probably my favorite of the bunch. If I'd had to improve it some way, I'd try giving it less demonic flavor, since Adventurers don't seem very related to Darkness and stuff. I think you could even change its class.

    R

    Show Spoiler
    Simple, yet effective and cohesive Quest. It's not very related to Barrens mechanically, but its mechanics are pretty universal on Hunter and the flavor is on point, so I wouldn't care too much. That said, watch out because the Quest and the Reward have the same name.

    EDIT: I think either the Quest or the reward could have a name related with survival, since the flavor kinda reminds me of a person who is fully equipped to survive in the wild. IDK.

    anchorm4n

    Show Spoiler
    I like the concept a lot, but the effect doesn't seem very related to the other cards Rogue has on Barrens. As I told many other people with the same issue, I'm not sure of how important this is.

    Finally, you should probably change the artwork of the reward, since it's the same as Yoink!

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  • anchorm4n's Avatar 1690 1881 Posts Joined 03/13/2019
    Posted 1 year, 3 months ago

    Alternative reward for my quest since I messed up the art.

    I notice I am confused. Something I believe isn't true. How do I know what I think I know?
    Harry James Potter-Evans-Verres, hpmor.com

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  • Demonxz95's Avatar Content Squad 2120 2207 Posts Joined 03/19/2019
    Posted 1 year, 3 months ago

    A mistake I am seeing some people make is including the Legendary gem on the reward (if it isn't a Hero Power). This isn't actually supposed to be there, though I won't be judging harshly on this aspect as it's not really that big of a deal.

    Here's some feedback too.

    Hordaki
    I will echo that the Reward is not particularly that strong for the amount of effort needed to get there (though an on-demand Freeze when you want it and combines with Reckless Apprentice is not something to scoff at). That said, the flavor is very much on point for the Barrens.

    Linkblade91
    I did of course already mention this on Discord, but I will mention it here as well for the sake of everyone reading. The requirement is particularly creative and interesting and fitting for the Druid class. I can see why people would find the Reward not particularly exciting, though I envisioned that being a Druid weapon would give it enough flair to overcome this. Pretty solid card overall I would say.

    BloodMefist
    I'm going to have to say the Quest is a bit weird. As noted, Altar of Fire is basically the only reliable way to complete it (other than maybe Azari, the Devourer but that takes a long time to get to). I'm going to say that I prefer the first Hero Power since the second one doesn't really have a way to make it reliable.

    Wailor
    I do think this is a solid card. Either design works for me, and I'm not quite sure which one is better.

    Lundy

    A thing about Lost in the Barrens that I don't particularly like is that, like Making Mummies, it relies on using a set-exclusive keyword. This means that it won't ever receive any additional support for the rest of the game's lifespan except for the end of year mini-set. This design isn't unprecedented as Making Mummies exists, but it's not one that I'm particularly fond of. As for the reward, I feel like most Frenzy effects aren't large enough to make the reward really good either.

    Embrace Insanity I do like better. The design is interesting in my opinion, although I don't think Elysiana needs "if you deck has no cards" as a condition since your deck will be empty anyway when you finish the Quest. In the rare instance where you do have cards in your deck after finishing the Quest, I don't think that needs to be a reason to limit the reward.

    Ritual of Summoning is a pretty neat idea, although I'm not sure if it should be placed right now in Hearthstone's current real life chronological context if we assume Adventurers to be a recurring part of the year (which it may or may not end up being) as the amount of cards that Warlock can use to get Adventurers right now is pretty limited. I'm not exactly sure how Portal of Summoning works either since it doesn't seem to have a mana cost or a card attached to it.

    R
    I'm particularly fond of the requirement design. I think this is a pretty neat card overall, though I unfortunately can't help you with the name as I don't have a good right one right now. That said, you definitely should change it before you submit it if you do want to submit this card.

    Anchorm4n
    I like the requirement. I think Pickpocketing is a good Hero Power (despite the usage of the Yoink! art). Fangs of the Father is something that could make a good Reward, although it is a bit incongruent with the Quest which encourages you to dump a lot of cards out of your hand, whereas Fangs of the Father wants you to have a lot of cards in your hand. Is the Fangs found in the Barrens? I'm not too sure.

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  • linkblade91's Avatar Global Moderator 1610 2072 Posts Joined 02/09/2019
    Posted 1 year, 3 months ago

    How's this for a better Horn of Hamuul?

    Connects better to what his great-nephew Guff Runetotem is looking to achieve. Collect a bunch of free Nature spells, then drop Guff and go to town buffing all the minions the Quest had you summon. Also works with Deviate Dreadfang.

    I'll be back with feedback tonight or tomorrow.

    If you have the time, you should totally check out our weekly Hearthstone card design competitions! :D

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  • Wailor's Avatar Design Champion 555 591 Posts Joined 05/28/2019
    Posted 1 year, 3 months ago
    Quote From Demonxz95

    A mistake I am seeing some people make is including the Legendary gem on the reward (if it isn't a Hero Power). This isn't actually supposed to be there, though I won't be judging harshly on this aspect as it's not really that big of a deal.

    Yup, Quest rewards used to have a Legendary gem time ago, but not anymore.

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  • grumpymonk's Avatar 360 137 Posts Joined 04/02/2020
    Posted 1 year, 3 months ago

    I found my way back to the discussion threads after teleport gunner sent me far away :)

    The first idea I have is a top-down, flavor based design of the Horde senting up encampments in the barrens. I put Rokara's ability as the requirement, as her story is about her training as part of the horde. I used watch posts as the reward to show the Horde setting up bases. It's pretty open ended, but it could help control Warrior decks and give new life to watch posts. Plus, it could make Kargal Battlescar playable.

    Edit: Found a piece of art that might be very fitting with the effect.

    I also made a sidequest (I could have sworn the prompt didn't allow it when I first saw it, I usually pay close attention to those things). There's a lot of beast synergy in the set, especially summoning beasts with rush and rewarding attacking with beasts. Savannah Highmane is a mob that is found in the barrens, and a commonly played cared back in the day, so I thought it would be a nice reward.

    This one is more of a thought experiment than one I intend to sumbit. It is intended to help self-destruction warlock without being too reliant on specific cards. Drawing the card for the turn counts as one, so drawing or removing at least two cards from your deck for the turn will help meet the requirement.

    Feedback:

    Demonxz95
    Cool idea! Maybe for added flavor, have the hero power swap based on casting a spell from the other school, like having a holy spell swap to the holy version and a shadow spell swap to the shadow version.

    linkblade91
    There isn't too much support for token druid in the barrens set overall, but I do think that this is a creative idea.

    BloodMeFist
    I like the second version of the hero power better because the first doesn't seem impactful enough and would require the deck-destruction warlock to build in another direction of top just to get any benefit without access to life tap.

    Wailor
    As far as I know, deathrattle demon hunter is more tempo oriented, so I would prefer the first option slightly over the second which is more value oriented. I think they are both good ideas, though.

    Lundy
    I think the payoff for the warrior quest needs to be much higher. There aren't many frenzy minions with big effects unlike Ossirian Tear which provides large amounts of value.

    I'm not a big fan of Embrace Insanity because the optimal play is to hold in your hand until you can fulfill the requirement immediately. It no longer functions much like a quest and plays more like a regular spell or a sigil.

    I like the idea of the adventuring quest, but it would require having to imagine more adventurer cards in the game that don't currently exist.

    Anchorm4n
    I like it. The optimal play might be to hold on to it until the turn before you fulfill the requirement rather than a turn one play to hide information, but I guess that its fitting for rogue to be sneaky about its adventures. I prefer the hero power as the reward because it not likely for many cards to be left in the player's hand once the quest is complete.

     

     

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  • BloodMefist's Avatar Content Squad Old God Fanatic 825 722 Posts Joined 05/28/2019
    Posted 1 year, 3 months ago

    It dawned on me that I could simply change the requirement to destroying cards in your deck, which makes Altar of Fire much less swingy in terms of completion. The quest can be completed with Altar of Fire, Soul Rend, Tickatus (uncorrupted), and Shadowlight Scholar or Void Drinker if you have Soul Fragments in your deck. Destroying 8 cards from your own deck is a bit tricky, but Warlocks ability to shuffle fodder cards into their deck can alleviate the cost. I could see reducing the requirement to 7, but 6 still has the problem of only needing 2 Altar of Fire.

    I agreed with some of the feedback that the passive hero power didn't really fit, so I made a version of the Discover one that is a bit more controlled at the expense of the reduced cost. I'll try to get feedback out sometime tomorrow!

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  • anchorm4n's Avatar 1690 1881 Posts Joined 03/13/2019
    Posted 1 year, 3 months ago

    Feedback time!

    BloodMefist
    Solid idea, I like the new iteration and the character you've used. Make sure you tap into the lore in the description box for us people who don't play WoW! I prefer the Hero Power without the Cost reduction since it's a pretty high rolly ability anyways.

    grumpymonk
    One of my favorites so far. Great flavor, great execution, I like it a lot. I prefer Sergra for the reward card.

    linkblade91
    I like how the Quest represents Guff in his very social, amiable way. The original reward card was interesting enough for me and would be fitting the friendship-theme, but it's also too close to Guff Runetotems already existing card. So yeah, the new version is better. Cool cards!

    Wailor
    I think I prefer the original Quest art or the one with Agamaggan on it, the one with the head has something dark to it that doesn't fit Hearthstone very well. The Hero Power definitely is the better reward for me. The whole concept is neat, but not very creative, which would result in a 4 stars rating from me.

    R
    Solid design overall. You should definitely change the names of both cards since they are too close to Hunter's Pack. Something like "Prepare for the Hunt" might be good for the Quest.

    Lundy
    Lost in the Barrens was to be expected in this competition, which is why I wouldn't choose to go with it - it's a bit too boring. I also don't think the flavor connects very well since being lost in the desert and suffering from delirium and experiencing battle rage after getting injured (=Frenzy) are two different things for me. Embrace Insanity is the one I like the most. You're missing a period at the end of the Quest card's text and I agree with Demon that the Reward doesn't need the condition of having an empty deck. Ritual of Summoning is too set-specific for my taste (that applys to Lost in the Barrens as well).

    Demonxz95
    One of my favorits, very cool design. The one thing I'd change is making the Hero Powers swap each turn instead of letting the player choose one of them. Healing for 6 and dealing 3 damage for only 2 mana is very strong, so the swapping effect tunes down the power level a bit without hurting the flavor.

    Hordaki
    Very strong card. I gave you 4 stars for now, might add a fifth once I've seen all entries.

    I notice I am confused. Something I believe isn't true. How do I know what I think I know?
    Harry James Potter-Evans-Verres, hpmor.com

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  • Hordaki's Avatar Dragon Scholar 650 264 Posts Joined 05/28/2019
    Posted 1 year, 3 months ago

    Thanks for all the feedback, guess it's time to return the favor.

    BloodMefist:

    Show Spoiler
    I think the deck version of Coldbringer is the better power out of the 2, but I'd leave the requirement at 8 destroyed cards.

    grumpymonk:

    Show Spoiler
    This is a great quest mechanically and flavorwise, although I think you may want to increase the requirement to 9-10, since I'd assume attacking the enemy hero would count and a aggro deck could abuse this.

    linkblade91:

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    Good flavor and mechanics, not much else to say.

    Wailor:

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    I'd go with the Agamaggan version, getting rid of DH's hero power is not a good move considering how much of their identity relies on that hero power. Although I think both versions feel a lot more like Hunter than Demon Hunter flavorwise.

    R:

    Show Spoiler
    I think the requirement is way too easy to achieve compared to the value of the hero power. Maybe just require controlling multiple secrets at the same time instead?

    Lundy:

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    Embrace Insanity is your best one, although I'd change Elysiana to a 5 mana 8/8 to match the Un'Goro quests.

    Demonzx95:

    Show Spoiler
    It's definitely a stranger quest than most, but I like it.

          -Hordaki (rhymes with Mordecai)

           Check out the Tactician custom class!

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  • linkblade91's Avatar Global Moderator 1610 2072 Posts Joined 02/09/2019
    Posted 1 year, 3 months ago

    Feedback:

    Show Spoiler

    BloodMefist - Bring the End is a great callback to WoW, and I've been looking for ways to utilize Amnennar, the Coldbringer in my custom cards. I like the idea of using an uncorrupted Tickatus, as well, because that adds interesting decision-making. I think I prefer the cost-reduction Hero Power, because it feels more of a reward that way. All-in-all, cool card, and I say that as someone who despises destroying their stuff!

    grumpymonk - You are correct: the prompt did not originally allow Sidequests, until someone asked about it lol. I like Horde Presence the most. It has a ton of flavor, what with Orgrimmar being right nearby, and we could always use another badass orc lady in the game.

    Wailor - I prefer the version where you get the minion: I think losing your Hero Power in DH is a BIG deal and should only happen on exceptionally rare cases. While the art for Agamaggan does in fact depict him…it's not very Hearthstone-friendly, with the gore on the ground and whatnot. I personally would be fine if you used the BG art, because it's not like another constructed card uses it.

    anchorm4n - In addition to my thoughts on Discord, I will agree with Demon's statement on Discord that Fangs of the Father clashes somewhat with the Quest's intention to dump your hand of cards. You might reach a situation where you have to swing the weapon with very few cards in-hand, and that would feel really bad. I think you're on the right track with a weapon, though.

    R - As I told anchorm4n on Discord, I believe Quests need to be achievable over time, rather than a Yes/No kind of objective. With this you either pull it off successfully or you completely fail to do so; there is no middle-ground. It would feel very bad for the player to lose - or win - a game having failed to make any progress with their Quest. This would also be rather hard to balance, because the deck can either readily achieve the Quest or it can't.

    Lundy - Embrace Insanity is probably the best one, but this is another Pass/Fail Quest that I find difficult to balance and get a feel for. In order to be good your deck would have to be really consistent, or it utterly fails to work. Also Elysiana should maybe be a 5/8/8, like the Quests of old, because that is a better reward for a long-form Quest.

    Demonxz95 - I gave my thoughts on Discord. I like the controllable switching aspect of the Hero Powers, in particular. Their names could maybe stand to be better, though.

    Hordaki - You definitely encompassed the various Barrens aspects of the Mage into your card; nice work there. Better than I did, at any rate. I will echo the desire to see the Hero Power be stronger, but that could also be coming from a position of not being able to test it. Seven Frost spells seems like an awful lot for a Hero Power change.

    If you have the time, you should totally check out our weekly Hearthstone card design competitions! :D

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