Hi there, you can call me Glen (not my real name) but that doesn’t really matter at this point.
Anyways, I decided to make this post so hopefully Riot could see it (whether it gets to that point who knows), but I think my point is very sound and hopefully, people will agree with me and Riot will actually consider this change.
To make a header, this post is directed at one main balance problem I have about this game - the randomness of who starts with the attack token first, and how the player who does not start with it IS NOT COMPENSATED AT ALL. They are simply at a disadvantage.
First of all a bit about my background with TCGs - I’m in my 30s, and have played TCGs since I was 10. I’ve played many TCGs, and at a very skillful and high level - I have competed at National level tournaments for World of Warcraft TCG (this is before Hearthstone), Magic the Gathering, Legend at Hearthstone, Highest level online cups at Faeria, and I’ve literally dabbled in every TCG game ever made. I was even the state champion for a TCGplayer.com event for Magic the Gathering one year. Now I say all this not to yank my chain, but to make a point - I know TCGs very well, and I know how they work at the core, what is fair and what is not fair, and what eventually drove me away from playing TCGs. I am not some random uninformed person moaning about something.
Now I”ve played LOR quite a lot - I daresay go to say, it is my favorite TCG of all time. That is ssaying A LOT. That means Riot has done a lot right- it has incorporated a lot of my favorite elements from all the TCGs i’ve ever played. Hell, I didn’t think I would play TCGs anymore because I got fed up at some game-breaking RNG factors that entail a lot of them. The spell mana bank is great - it allows you to stay in the game even if you miss your 1 or 2 drop cards and you don’t have them to begin with. I like the increased CARD DRAW because it means RNG is LESS of a factor, because you simply have more options per turn (and so does your opponent). No more getting screwed bc you didn’t draw enough lands like Magic, obviously - something Hearthstone spearheaded a while ago. A LOT of things done right- and I’ve had a LOT of fun playing this game because it was so very highly dependent on player choices. Except for one big thing that is really starting to turn me away.
You see, I am the type of player that doesn’t like to lose because of RNG. I study matchups, I study cards, I know all the cards, I know all the scenarios, I typically make as many right decisions as I can. I don’t like to lose because i happened to not draw the right card or bc RNG threw me a curveball. In fact I quit a lot of the TCGs that I spent hundreds of hours and thousands of dollars on bc I got fed up at that. And I fear that, if this balance change is not addressed - it will drive some of LoR’s most passionate players away. Because this game is touted as a “played skill above all” game - it is not advertised like Hearthstone, which is known and does not even try to hide the high level of RNG present in their game. It considers RNG as part of the “fun”. Sure, it is fun if you like RNG. But I think I, and many other players who REALLY like LoR, are drawn to it because you win your games PRIMARILY on skill and when i say PRIMARILY I mean a much higher number than 75 or 80% skill and 20% luck. Yes RNG is always SOME of a factor in card games, this is unavoidable as the nature of the card game, but in this game, its supposed to be VERY minimal. Even the RNG card design is aimed at to be “not all RNG” but RNG based on player choices - take the Allegiance keyword or say “Make it Rain” etc etc as detailed in Riot’s blog post.
Now I am primarily an Aggro player or midrange player, I do not typically enjoy playing control, though I can very well play it and actually play it very well. But aggro is my goto style. And because of that I noticed a glaring unequality in the fact who starts with the attack token first.
This inequality is really easily visible for aggro decks and for players using cards(mainly champions) who have QUICK ATTACK. See, quick attack is garbage on defense but GODLIKE on offense. Sure, nothing wrong with that. It’s the design. But hear me out (and i might be a little unclear in how I describe it) - certain champions with quick attack get a HUGE advantage, especially if theyre an aggro deck, when you get to play them RIGHT ON CURVE. And since you can’t play Allies with banked spell mana - it comes down to a complete RNG factor - did i start with the attack token this game, did I drew my bombass champion (Zed, Miss Fortune main culprits I see here), Drawn or Katarina lesser culprits, even Elise who gets to attack on curve turn 2 and get that free spider. And THERE IS NO compensation for the player who doesn’t start with the attack token, and I think there should be.
I played many Zed aggro mirror matches, and basically, the guy who goes first with the attack token - all things being equal, meaning all players making optimal decision - he will almost always win if he gets the attack token first and plays the Zed on attack turn 3. You can’t actually counter Zed easily unless you have a Mystic Shot type card and THERE AREN’T REALLY MANY CARDS OUT THERE that can do that. And you can’t block him, not on turn 3 really - very few cards capable of blocking and coming out on top. He’ll get that free 3/2 shadow and hit you in the face for 3 even if you sac one of ur guys to chump block and basically… he’s coming out WAY on top just bc he happened to start with the attack token first. I’m literally playing mirror matches with BETTER CARDS drawn than him sitting in my hand, and a Zed sitting in my hand - but because I CAN’T ATTACK on turn 3, he wins the aggro race bc you almost CANT block Zed that early. So I play my Zed turn 4 and attack but by then it’s too late - i’ve already had to sacrifice a unit to keep him from leveling up or just taking the dmg to the face and I’m WAY in the deficit. And this is all not because I got outplayed, but because he happened to start with the attack token first which is a COMPLETE RNG factor.
But not just talking about Zed, there are many champions who really benefit from having their turn line up right when they need to attack - Take Draven, or Miss Fortune, Jinx, yasuo - if your turn lines up, say T3 for Zed, Drvaen or Miss Fortune and you HAPPENED to start with the attack token - you get a BIG bonus and basically a free attack which is HUGE for aggro players. This is most prominent with Zed bc not only do they have to chump block you but even if they do, they still take some damage from the shadow. Jinx Yasuo on turn 4- free attack basically. You get the idea. It’s easier to deal with the more turns there are in the game when said champion is played but the RNG factor if you get to play these champs RIGHT on curve is just so game winning. And it would be OK, but here’s the thing - why is there no compensation for who doesn’t get to attack first? For instance, Hearthstone does this right- they give the turn 2 player “The Coin”. But in LoR, theres no such thing- the second turn player just gets to be at a clear disadvantage. Yes its not AS OBVIOUS in some deck matchups, like in control, its not as obvious but when you’re playing aggro? Or playing AGINST aggro? It makes A WORLD of difference.
Basically, I feel that the second player should be compensated somehow for not getting to attack first. The player who gets the attack token first is LITERALLY a turn ahead sometimes, just because… they get to attack one turn earlier than their opponent! And combined with certain cards and champions and keywords THIS. IS. DEVASTATING. It is not fair.
Now I haven’t thought about the specifics of how to balance this but I do know this - something should be done about this if ya’ll pride this game on being “skill above all” because I”ve lost so many games as aggro and against aggro because I was not able to be on curve with my attack lineups. For instance hearthstone has the coin for the t2 player, I’m sure something could be thought out for LoR.
Thank you for listening to me, and I’d love to hear your opinions on what ya’ll think - if you support me, or disagree - and if you disagree, how do you think making it completely random who attacks first with no compensation for the T2 player balanced?
Hi there, you can call me Glen (not my real name) but that doesn’t really matter at this point.
Anyways, I decided to make this post so hopefully Riot could see it (whether it gets to that point who knows), but I think my point is very sound and hopefully, people will agree with me and Riot will actually consider this change.
To make a header, this post is directed at one main balance problem I have about this game - the randomness of who starts with the attack token first, and how the player who does not start with it IS NOT COMPENSATED AT ALL. They are simply at a disadvantage.
First of all a bit about my background with TCGs - I’m in my 30s, and have played TCGs since I was 10. I’ve played many TCGs, and at a very skillful and high level - I have competed at National level tournaments for World of Warcraft TCG (this is before Hearthstone), Magic the Gathering, Legend at Hearthstone, Highest level online cups at Faeria, and I’ve literally dabbled in every TCG game ever made. I was even the state champion for a TCGplayer.com event for Magic the Gathering one year. Now I say all this not to yank my chain, but to make a point - I know TCGs very well, and I know how they work at the core, what is fair and what is not fair, and what eventually drove me away from playing TCGs. I am not some random uninformed person moaning about something.
Now I”ve played LOR quite a lot - I daresay go to say, it is my favorite TCG of all time. That is ssaying A LOT. That means Riot has done a lot right- it has incorporated a lot of my favorite elements from all the TCGs i’ve ever played. Hell, I didn’t think I would play TCGs anymore because I got fed up at some game-breaking RNG factors that entail a lot of them. The spell mana bank is great - it allows you to stay in the game even if you miss your 1 or 2 drop cards and you don’t have them to begin with. I like the increased CARD DRAW because it means RNG is LESS of a factor, because you simply have more options per turn (and so does your opponent). No more getting screwed bc you didn’t draw enough lands like Magic, obviously - something Hearthstone spearheaded a while ago. A LOT of things done right- and I’ve had a LOT of fun playing this game because it was so very highly dependent on player choices. Except for one big thing that is really starting to turn me away.
You see, I am the type of player that doesn’t like to lose because of RNG. I study matchups, I study cards, I know all the cards, I know all the scenarios, I typically make as many right decisions as I can. I don’t like to lose because i happened to not draw the right card or bc RNG threw me a curveball. In fact I quit a lot of the TCGs that I spent hundreds of hours and thousands of dollars on bc I got fed up at that. And I fear that, if this balance change is not addressed - it will drive some of LoR’s most passionate players away. Because this game is touted as a “played skill above all” game - it is not advertised like Hearthstone, which is known and does not even try to hide the high level of RNG present in their game. It considers RNG as part of the “fun”. Sure, it is fun if you like RNG. But I think I, and many other players who REALLY like LoR, are drawn to it because you win your games PRIMARILY on skill and when i say PRIMARILY I mean a much higher number than 75 or 80% skill and 20% luck. Yes RNG is always SOME of a factor in card games, this is unavoidable as the nature of the card game, but in this game, its supposed to be VERY minimal. Even the RNG card design is aimed at to be “not all RNG” but RNG based on player choices - take the Allegiance keyword or say “Make it Rain” etc etc as detailed in Riot’s blog post.
Now I am primarily an Aggro player or midrange player, I do not typically enjoy playing control, though I can very well play it and actually play it very well. But aggro is my goto style. And because of that I noticed a glaring unequality in the fact who starts with the attack token first.
This inequality is really easily visible for aggro decks and for players using cards(mainly champions) who have QUICK ATTACK. See, quick attack is garbage on defense but GODLIKE on offense. Sure, nothing wrong with that. It’s the design. But hear me out (and i might be a little unclear in how I describe it) - certain champions with quick attack get a HUGE advantage, especially if theyre an aggro deck, when you get to play them RIGHT ON CURVE. And since you can’t play Allies with banked spell mana - it comes down to a complete RNG factor - did i start with the attack token this game, did I drew my bombass champion (Zed, Miss Fortune main culprits I see here), Drawn or Katarina lesser culprits, even Elise who gets to attack on curve turn 2 and get that free spider. And THERE IS NO compensation for the player who doesn’t start with the attack token, and I think there should be.
I played many Zed aggro mirror matches, and basically, the guy who goes first with the attack token - all things being equal, meaning all players making optimal decision - he will almost always win if he gets the attack token first and plays the Zed on attack turn 3. You can’t actually counter Zed easily unless you have a Mystic Shot type card and THERE AREN’T REALLY MANY CARDS OUT THERE that can do that. And you can’t block him, not on turn 3 really - very few cards capable of blocking and coming out on top. He’ll get that free 3/2 shadow and hit you in the face for 3 even if you sac one of ur guys to chump block and basically… he’s coming out WAY on top just bc he happened to start with the attack token first. I’m literally playing mirror matches with BETTER CARDS drawn than him sitting in my hand, and a Zed sitting in my hand - but because I CAN’T ATTACK on turn 3, he wins the aggro race bc you almost CANT block Zed that early. So I play my Zed turn 4 and attack but by then it’s too late - i’ve already had to sacrifice a unit to keep him from leveling up or just taking the dmg to the face and I’m WAY in the deficit. And this is all not because I got outplayed, but because he happened to start with the attack token first which is a COMPLETE RNG factor.
But not just talking about Zed, there are many champions who really benefit from having their turn line up right when they need to attack - Take Draven, or Miss Fortune, Jinx, yasuo - if your turn lines up, say T3 for Zed, Drvaen or Miss Fortune and you HAPPENED to start with the attack token - you get a BIG bonus and basically a free attack which is HUGE for aggro players. This is most prominent with Zed bc not only do they have to chump block you but even if they do, they still take some damage from the shadow. Jinx Yasuo on turn 4- free attack basically. You get the idea. It’s easier to deal with the more turns there are in the game when said champion is played but the RNG factor if you get to play these champs RIGHT on curve is just so game winning. And it would be OK, but here’s the thing - why is there no compensation for who doesn’t get to attack first? For instance, Hearthstone does this right- they give the turn 2 player “The Coin”. But in LoR, theres no such thing- the second turn player just gets to be at a clear disadvantage. Yes its not AS OBVIOUS in some deck matchups, like in control, its not as obvious but when you’re playing aggro? Or playing AGINST aggro? It makes A WORLD of difference.
Basically, I feel that the second player should be compensated somehow for not getting to attack first. The player who gets the attack token first is LITERALLY a turn ahead sometimes, just because… they get to attack one turn earlier than their opponent! And combined with certain cards and champions and keywords THIS. IS. DEVASTATING. It is not fair.
Now I haven’t thought about the specifics of how to balance this but I do know this - something should be done about this if ya’ll pride this game on being “skill above all” because I”ve lost so many games as aggro and against aggro because I was not able to be on curve with my attack lineups. For instance hearthstone has the coin for the t2 player, I’m sure something could be thought out for LoR.
Thank you for listening to me, and I’d love to hear your opinions on what ya’ll think - if you support me, or disagree - and if you disagree, how do you think making it completely random who attacks first with no compensation for the T2 player balanced?