When the options of truly viable strong decks are limited to less decks than you can count on one hand, netdecking is inevitable.
That said, it is also inevitable in any game where players compete and want the best possible chance of winning. Hating netdeckers in a game like this is the same as hating Bodybuilders who cheat by going to the gym, or hating football teams who use scouts to get the best players instead of the manager looking for them himself.
Our first Netdecking post! We should take a picture or something... :-)
Just kidding (Actually I can't verify that as I've not scoured the list)
Anyway, on a more serious and back to your topic: There is something really useful about netdecks - they give people a chance to play decent decks if they don't have the skills in deck creation that others do.
This is important for some players because they can be really skillful players, but would struggle to make an optimised deck, so it is a case of relying on the help of others to get the best game play.
An additional thing about netdecking is that the problem usually isnt the netdecks themselves, it's something that is more intrinsic to card-based games in general and that's the lack of diversity that can often come from only a small number of decks that end up ruling the meta. Because these decks are so strong, they are super-popular, and people naturally want to win, so they look for and choose what seems to be the easiest road to obtaining that win.
I was really interested in Artifact, from the time of its announcement through to the release. Then, when I saw the pricing model, I was hesitant enough to wait and see how the game panned out first.
I'm pretty much glad I held off in the end. Bullet dodged there...
I know that both Day9 and Savjz do streams for Arena now - though I don't know how beginner-friendly they are; but I found Day9's videos on Youtube provide good entertainment and you start to pick up bits as he plays and talks... and talks... and talks... lol
In terms of beginner packs, etc - what I was told by the Arena community in general, was to complete the new player experience first before buying anything - you get a load of packs and cards and decks that way to start you off.
And after that, if you're wanting to focus on building a collection that is usable for the most time, to get packs from the latest 3 expacs (Ravnica Guild, Allegiance and War of the Spark). Apparently the Shock lands in the Allegiance (I think it is? Please double check that) are really important. And the War of the Spark is pretty much loads of Planeswalkers, which are very powerful.
Magic is also really good (and a lot less frustraing than HS Arena mode I find) - not to mention, drafting in Hearthstone lets you keep the cards you draft! This is HUGE! Imagine if you could do that in HS-Arena? It would be so much more popular.
JUST to correct you, to not find people not understanding this, the right sentence is:
drafting inMagiclets you keep the cards you draft! This is HUGE! Imagine if you could do that in HS-Arena? It would be so much more popular.
Anyway, a problem on this is that Hearthstone got less cards every expac or anyway the game can't permit a similar system due to pity timer etc etc, really problematic trust me.
BUT, i would enjoy a format like that, even if I have to spend 1000 golds to get 5 packs, making decks made of 25 cards.
Oops! Haha! Yes, I meant drafting in Magic. And yeah, the reason it would probably not work so well in Hearthstone is admittedly due to the low card pool.
But that said, it wouldbe nice if you could atleast choose a number of cards you drafted to keep at the end of a run. Or something to that effect. Even if it made the Arena more expensive to play. Just an idea, really.
I am really surprised they never carried on producing Rogue Secrets. When they first came out, I was excited to think that maybe other classes would start benefitting from this mechanic as well, but not only did that never materialise, but also Rogue basically got a couple of naff secrets and one good one, and that was it.
I really hope that Blizzard reconsider this at some point and consider making the Secrets a more widely available mechanic. That, and better options for anti-secret techs too.
I'm rather surprised that Blizzard have chosen not to consider nerfs for Warrior right now, considering how oppressive and pervasive it is currently.
Cards like [Hearthstone Card (Omega Devestator) Not Found] and Dyn-o-matic in particular are desperately in need of a re-balance as they are dominant right now.
It's also surprising that they consider Mage to be a good matchup against Control Warrior - with Shield Slams and the previously aforemention devestators, the Book Mage deck (probably the most common currently) gets roasted. At least, that's what I've experienced personally when I see a Mage come up against my Warrior deck. Giants are easily dealt with by this class. So much removal!
As far as Cyclone Mage goes, well let's be fair - that deck's kind of a joke meme deck and I don't think it has much to offer in the way of threat to Warrior Control decks right now. Lol!
This deck seems to be getting some popularity right now, and since I pulled 2 [Hearthstone Card (Command the Dreadhorde) Not Found]s from my starter packs, I decided to start building towards it while I play other decks.
Anyone else tried this deck yet? Can you offer any thoughts on it? And deck strategies / tips for this one would be cool too. :-)
Magic has the attraction that playing the non-ranked standard mode is really good fun and you don't have the added stress of worrying about ranks and things like that. Not to mention the fact than in unranked, the decks are really varied, with all sorts of janky homebrews and interesting mechanics going on.
I am constantly surprised (in a good way) with some of the decks I see and each time it inspires me to go find out how to build a similar deck and what I can do with it.
I'm sure ranked mode is cool and all, but for the moment, I don't find myself having any desire to venture into there when I'm having this much fun already.
The draft mode for Magic is also really good (and a lot less frustraing than HS Arena mode I find) - not to mention, drafting in Hearthstone lets you keep the cards you draft! This is HUGE! Imagine if you could do that in HS-Arena? It would be so much more popular.
This season's been a little bit frustrating for me, in fairness. It should have had the opportunity for some really fun and interesting decks, but the flood of Rogue and Warrior players has just made it a huge mess.
Even though Rogue received a much needed nerf and has seen a lot less play, the downside is that Control Warrior seems to have taken over instead and this deck is even more exasperatingly frustrating to play against because you know the game will go on for ages until Fatigue, every time.
All that said (and mini-rant over), I am looking forward to the buffs. I have a Boomzooka Hunter deck that I run which is almost Tier 2 currently, it just lacks a little bit of power in the earlier stages - and I am fully expecting that the upcoming buffs to both Flark's Boomzooka and The double deathrattle card should hopefully give it a slightly better edge.
Watch this space and I'll upload the deck when I've had a chance to get more time with it and see how the buffs play out. :-)
As someone who isn't a BIG MTG player, but does play it occasionally and is interested in getting into it more, I have actually considered getting MTG: Arena. It looks really cool and faithful to the original game and it would probably help me learn more about it.
I must ask though, how is the F2P experience for you guys? I've heard both ends of the spectrum before.
I'm definitely not free to play in MTGA, but from what I can tell, the experience is better than Hearthstone.
I did a sponsored stream with Wizards back when they created their new "character progression" system and the unlock pace felt good, the decks performed decently on the ladder (I'm certain can be modified a bit to get even better), and in the end you get quite a few cards. From just the new player perspective, there should be hours of enjoyment without spending a dime.
It also feels more rewarding to go through your daily wins and quest progression. Getting random cards after you get past a certain number of wins is also super cool. I don't know if there is a certain pool they can come from but free cards is always great.
I'm not sure about the whole card crafting system though. It feels better than Hearthstone since you accumulate "wild cards" to turn into whatever card you desire but on paper it may be worse. There is no disenchanting so you have to keep all the cards you will never end up playing with which I know for some F2P players in Hearthstone, that could be an issue.
I definitely recommend giving it a shot though when you're feeling bored and not interested in Hearthstone.
I can confirm that the New Player progression in MtG:A is definitely very good. You feel rewarded for every game you play and you can build up a nice little starter collection quite easily. It takes a good few hours worth of game time to complete the progression path and as you go along the game drip-feeds you new cards and decks to try out.
I found for me personally that the best thing to do was not to buy any packs (or do any drafts) with the in game gold until getting all the starter decks and cards first. THat way you don't end up duping anything and you can find a deck style that interests you.
The thing I have always liked the most about MtG (at least from a nonranked game perspective) is that there are so many different decks to come up against and two games rarely feel the same. I've never had two people playing the same deck in a row in any games I've played over the last few weeks - you wouldn't believe how refreshing that is after Hearthstone Ladder! Haha! :-)
As the title suggests, if you go to your profile page and click either the Threads or the Decks button, you get redirected to a blank error page stating that the resource is not found on the server.
Hiya - apologies if I am jumping the gun here and it's already being sorted. I went to click on my thread about MTG:Arena, (which looks like it's been moved to the Magic General section) - but I don't appear to have access to it? (I get a 403 Access Denied).
It's possible that it's still being configured and I'm just too quick of course, lol. Just wondered if I needed to do anything to access that part. :-)
In the presumably short and small - that's what sh-... no... - absence of a dedicated section for MtG Arena players and lovers in here, I am creating this thread as the go to place (for now) for your MtG needs.
If you want to grab a game against me and one of my half-baked, god-awful nooby decks, then feel free to see if I'm around and send me a challenge. my Username is:
Scorpyon#47528
At the moment I am attempting to build some sort of weird and janky Amass based Black / White deck, and another silly discard Win-With-Jace blue deck. :-P
Yes, along the lines of what the others have said, it is a case of working out when the card is good and against which match ups. As you say, it may struggle against Warpath, but fortunately that is limited to Warrior and most other classes will have a much harder time clearing your board effectively twice. It's a great card - it simply requires a little forethought before playing it and learning what answers to expect the opponent to have.
I've come across something rather odd. I am reporting it here, but will try and see if I can reproduce the issue on a regular basis if I can. Ok, I actually just managed to do it. Often, if I use Shift+Space to go to the next line, I find that the space bar suddenly stops working (This seems to occur on the 3rd time I use the Shift+Space - so the third line).
Looking into this a bit further, it's fine if I use a standard carriage return (like to this paragraph). It also seems to be if I press Space Bar, BEFORE I start typing, it will jump me back to the previous line. By no means game-breaking, but can be annoying. Likethislinehere.ThethirdShift+Spaceperparagraphhasstoppedmyspacebarworking.
But if I do a normal return, the space bar works again.
I dont know about you guys, but I love kobolds, not just in hearthstone, but in dungeons and dragons as well. I just think they are a neat race and I would love to play a kobold themed deck in hearthstone. but the problem is that if this were to ever happen, it would mean that we would need another expansion featuring kobolds. and there are so many other races to explore, for example, touren, or pandarin.
I have to admit, I am actually rather surprised that there hasn't been one yet. When Kobolds and Catacombs was first announced, I was almost certain that might have been the direction that they were heading in. Apparently not. But that doesn't mean there never will be.
When the options of truly viable strong decks are limited to less decks than you can count on one hand, netdecking is inevitable.
That said, it is also inevitable in any game where players compete and want the best possible chance of winning. Hating netdeckers in a game like this is the same as hating Bodybuilders who cheat by going to the gym, or hating football teams who use scouts to get the best players instead of the manager looking for them himself.
It's nonsensical at best, naive at worst. :-D
Our first Netdecking post! We should take a picture or something... :-)
Just kidding (Actually I can't verify that as I've not scoured the list)
Anyway, on a more serious and back to your topic:
There is something really useful about netdecks - they give people a chance to play decent decks if they don't have the skills in deck creation that others do.
This is important for some players because they can be really skillful players, but would struggle to make an optimised deck, so it is a case of relying on the help of others to get the best game play.
An additional thing about netdecking is that the problem usually isnt the netdecks themselves, it's something that is more intrinsic to card-based games in general and that's the lack of diversity that can often come from only a small number of decks that end up ruling the meta.
Because these decks are so strong, they are super-popular, and people naturally want to win, so they look for and choose what seems to be the easiest road to obtaining that win.
Ok, sounds great - thanks for the reply :-)
I was really interested in Artifact, from the time of its announcement through to the release. Then, when I saw the pricing model, I was hesitant enough to wait and see how the game panned out first.
I'm pretty much glad I held off in the end. Bullet dodged there...
I know that both Day9 and Savjz do streams for Arena now - though I don't know how beginner-friendly they are; but I found Day9's videos on Youtube provide good entertainment and you start to pick up bits as he plays and talks... and talks... and talks... lol
In terms of beginner packs, etc - what I was told by the Arena community in general, was to complete the new player experience first before buying anything - you get a load of packs and cards and decks that way to start you off.
And after that, if you're wanting to focus on building a collection that is usable for the most time, to get packs from the latest 3 expacs (Ravnica Guild, Allegiance and War of the Spark).
Apparently the Shock lands in the Allegiance (I think it is? Please double check that) are really important. And the War of the Spark is pretty much loads of Planeswalkers, which are very powerful.
Oops! Haha! Yes, I meant drafting in Magic.
And yeah, the reason it would probably not work so well in Hearthstone is admittedly due to the low card pool.
But that said, it wouldbe nice if you could atleast choose a number of cards you drafted to keep at the end of a run. Or something to that effect. Even if it made the Arena more expensive to play.
Just an idea, really.
Shameless bump in case this got missed. :-D
I am really surprised they never carried on producing Rogue Secrets.
When they first came out, I was excited to think that maybe other classes would start benefitting from this mechanic as well, but not only did that never materialise, but also Rogue basically got a couple of naff secrets and one good one, and that was it.
I really hope that Blizzard reconsider this at some point and consider making the Secrets a more widely available mechanic.
That, and better options for anti-secret techs too.
I possibly should have specified:
It wasn't intended as a complaint, it was just a bug report. (Assuming this is the place for that.:-D )
I'm rather surprised that Blizzard have chosen not to consider nerfs for Warrior right now, considering how oppressive and pervasive it is currently.
Cards like [Hearthstone Card (Omega Devestator) Not Found] and Dyn-o-matic in particular are desperately in need of a re-balance as they are dominant right now.
It's also surprising that they consider Mage to be a good matchup against Control Warrior - with Shield Slams and the previously aforemention devestators, the Book Mage deck (probably the most common currently) gets roasted. At least, that's what I've experienced personally when I see a Mage come up against my Warrior deck. Giants are easily dealt with by this class. So much removal!
As far as Cyclone Mage goes, well let's be fair - that deck's kind of a joke meme deck and I don't think it has much to offer in the way of threat to Warrior Control decks right now. Lol!
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/command-the-dreadhorde/
This deck seems to be getting some popularity right now, and since I pulled 2 [Hearthstone Card (Command the Dreadhorde) Not Found]s from my starter packs, I decided to start building towards it while I play other decks.
Anyone else tried this deck yet? Can you offer any thoughts on it?
And deck strategies / tips for this one would be cool too. :-)
Magic has the attraction that playing the non-ranked standard mode is really good fun and you don't have the added stress of worrying about ranks and things like that.
Not to mention the fact than in unranked, the decks are really varied, with all sorts of janky homebrews and interesting mechanics going on.
I am constantly surprised (in a good way) with some of the decks I see and each time it inspires me to go find out how to build a similar deck and what I can do with it.
I'm sure ranked mode is cool and all, but for the moment, I don't find myself having any desire to venture into there when I'm having this much fun already.
The draft mode for Magic is also really good (and a lot less frustraing than HS Arena mode I find) - not to mention, drafting in Hearthstone lets you keep the cards you draft! This is HUGE! Imagine if you could do that in HS-Arena? It would be so much more popular.
This season's been a little bit frustrating for me, in fairness.
It should have had the opportunity for some really fun and interesting decks, but the flood of Rogue and Warrior players has just made it a huge mess.
Even though Rogue received a much needed nerf and has seen a lot less play, the downside is that Control Warrior seems to have taken over instead and this deck is even more exasperatingly frustrating to play against because you know the game will go on for ages until Fatigue, every time.
All that said (and mini-rant over), I am looking forward to the buffs.
I have a Boomzooka Hunter deck that I run which is almost Tier 2 currently, it just lacks a little bit of power in the earlier stages - and I am fully expecting that the upcoming buffs to both Flark's Boomzooka and The double deathrattle card should hopefully give it a slightly better edge.
Watch this space and I'll upload the deck when I've had a chance to get more time with it and see how the buffs play out. :-)
I can confirm that the New Player progression in MtG:A is definitely very good. You feel rewarded for every game you play and you can build up a nice little starter collection quite easily. It takes a good few hours worth of game time to complete the progression path and as you go along the game drip-feeds you new cards and decks to try out.
I found for me personally that the best thing to do was not to buy any packs (or do any drafts) with the in game gold until getting all the starter decks and cards first. THat way you don't end up duping anything and you can find a deck style that interests you.
The thing I have always liked the most about MtG (at least from a nonranked game perspective) is that there are so many different decks to come up against and two games rarely feel the same.
I've never had two people playing the same deck in a row in any games I've played over the last few weeks - you wouldn't believe how refreshing that is after Hearthstone Ladder! Haha! :-)
As the title suggests, if you go to your profile page and click either the Threads or the Decks button, you get redirected to a blank error page stating that the resource is not found on the server.
Hiya - apologies if I am jumping the gun here and it's already being sorted.
I went to click on my thread about MTG:Arena, (which looks like it's been moved to the Magic General section) - but I don't appear to have access to it?
(I get a 403 Access Denied).
It's possible that it's still being configured and I'm just too quick of course, lol.
Just wondered if I needed to do anything to access that part. :-)
In the presumably short and small - that's what sh-... no... - absence of a dedicated section for MtG Arena players and lovers in here, I am creating this thread as the go to place (for now) for your MtG needs.
If you want to grab a game against me and one of my half-baked, god-awful nooby decks, then feel free to see if I'm around and send me a challenge.
my Username is:
Scorpyon#47528
At the moment I am attempting to build some sort of weird and janky Amass based Black / White deck, and another silly discard Win-With-Jace blue deck. :-P
Come join me here and there. ;-)
Yes, along the lines of what the others have said, it is a case of working out when the card is good and against which match ups. As you say, it may struggle against Warpath, but fortunately that is limited to Warrior and most other classes will have a much harder time clearing your board effectively twice.
It's a great card - it simply requires a little forethought before playing it and learning what answers to expect the opponent to have.
Best of luck! :-D
I've come across something rather odd.
I am reporting it here, but will try and see if I can reproduce the issue on a regular basis if I can.
Ok, I actually just managed to do it. Often, if I use Shift+Space to go to the next line, I find that the space bar suddenly stops working (This seems to occur on the 3rd time I use the Shift+Space - so the third line).
Looking into this a bit further, it's fine if I use a standard carriage return (like to this paragraph). It also seems to be if I press Space Bar, BEFORE I start typing, it will jump me back to the previous line.
By no means game-breaking, but can be annoying.
Likethislinehere.ThethirdShift+Spaceperparagraphhasstoppedmyspacebarworking.
But if I do a normal return, the space bar works again.
Weird. :-)
I have to admit, I am actually rather surprised that there hasn't been one yet.
When Kobolds and Catacombs was first announced, I was almost certain that might have been the direction that they were heading in. Apparently not.
But that doesn't mean there never will be.