So I beat all 5 chapters last night, and it was an entertaining jog. I'm not going to complain about how easy it was (I even lost twice), but the final test just... ended. It wasn't clear to me what triggered the win condition. I had stabilized at pretty high health and was probably considered to be winning. I don't think I had even knocked down the opponent's HP to even 50% when it stopped and went into the final dialogue. It felt very anti-climactic.
I always argued that because it wasn't a Twinspell keyword that Twin Slice should cost 1 and Second Slice could/should cost 0. Ultimately this is a back-end nerf to Altruis the Outcast.
I'm not sure I've seen a Quest Warrior with Battle Rage. I never felt card draw was a problem. If you get Ancharr as your first weapon (1/3 of the time), then you'll keep getting it back from Hoard Pillager. So the Sky Raiders get drawn and thin your deck. And they're useful combos with Risky Skipper, can generate a Risky Skipper, can generate a taunt, can generate a legendary Pirate, etc. It never felt bad to play/include.
It really does play like a control deck. You're trying to keep the board clear, stabilize your armor, and outvalue your opponent. The burst from Grommash is important, but it's not a combo deck.
The other four cards I named - Battlefiend, Satyr Overseer, Altruis the Outcast, and Warglaives of Azzinoth are all OP cards in their own right because of their strong synergy with Demon Hunter's hero power and Chaos Strike, another OP staple of the class (that probably doesn't need a nerf, but boy do I hate how Skull of Gul'dan chains into it). You don't need to nerf those other four, even Altruis, if you deal with Twin Slice.
I really like all these buffs and nerfs, but let's talk Demon Hunter. I'm glad to see the health nerf to 5 on Priestess of Fury. I think it's a strong and balanced card now. Crimson Sigil Runner wasn't on my radar, but it's also a great nerf.
The single most problematic card in Demon Hunter is Twin Slice. It synergizes too well with too many other strong cards. Battlefiend, Satyr Overseer, Altruis the Outcast, and Warglaives of Azzinoth. It needs to be nerfed to 1 mana while keeping Second Slice at 0 mana (it's not a Twinspell!). It goes beyond what's generally considered a fair effect for the cost. We all agree Twin Slice would be broken in Rogue and unplayable in Mage, right? It's equally broken in Demon Hunter. As much as I think Altruis the Outcast shouldn't deal face damage or would like to see further nerfs to the class' draw engine, changing Twin Slice to 1 mana solves so many of these problems on its own.
I'm sure it's a blast to play ;). I can't imagine climbing the ladder without my lackeys from Livewire Lance. Demon Hunters rarely wait long enough to kill you for the bombs to go off. Gan'arg is definitely an odd card, and a decent candidate to swap for something else. It really shines though when you get it in your opening hand with coin.
Extremely necessary. It's the top draw engine for the deck. You'll still have fun if you replace it with Fiery War Axe, but I have to imagine your win-rate will take a big hit. I can't predict the future, but I think Risky Skipper is going to be a Warrior staple for another year until rotation, meaning that Ancharrr will be too. I know Ancharrr was only used for pirate aggro at first, but I think it's an extremely great tool for all archetypes moving forward. I don't think you'll regret crafting it if you like playing Warrior.
LEGEND ACHIEVED. I started from Platinum 5 - 2 stars because I came in off a win-streak. I just completed my 80th game to hit Legend, going 47-33 for a final win-rate of 58.75%. This took me about 6 days, so I was playing about 13-14 per day. Obviously getting to Legend is easier than ever (this is my first time in the new system, second time ever), but I hope sharing these stats helps players understand what it takes.
My greatest losing streak was going from rank 1-2 to rank 2-0, a net loss of 5 stars in a play session. That can be enough to make you quit climbing or question your deck choice or start a new thread about nerfs to whichever card just cost you the last game (but seriously, please nerf Twin Slice).
This deck is extremely hard to pilot, and I made misplays even today. The easiest mistake is forgetting to hero power before attacking, especially when your quest is 4/5 complete for that 2-extra game-making/breaking armor. I'll save the rest for the guide I plan to add to my deck.
Wow, thanks for the shout-out! I was literally playing the Quest Warrior deck as I read this article. I'm currently 35-25 (58%), sitting at Platinum 2 - 3 stars. I'm determined to hit legend with it this month. Theoretically, I'm only about another 25-30 games away, but maybe I'll hit a four game win streak tonight! (The road to legend is still a grind even with the new easier system). I plan to write a guide when I hit legend.
Somewhat unrelated, but any word on when the single player content is supposed to release? Wouldn't this usually be the week given how release schedules have gone the last several cycles. It seems like it's been oddly quiet,
I'm exclusively playing my own variant of Quest Warrior on my road to legend. I started at Platinum 5-2 after coming in on a win streak. I'm 18-12 so far - exactly 60%, BUT 13-7 - 65% in my last 20 games. It's a hard deck to pilot. Tough decisions on what to play or hold on many turns, as well as attack and play order.
The toughest match-ups are Demon Hunter and Rogue, the best classes anyway because of their insane draw engines. But it has the tools to outlast both extreme aggro and extreme value. It takes down all Priest variants very well, and easily outlasts the other Warrior variants. It does very well against Face Hunter and Zoolock, but does struggle against those classes' Highlander variants depending on the draw.
I was playing Quest Warrior for a few days and really thought it was the meta-breaker. It's a really strong deck where I lost several games through genuine misplaying (attacking or not attacking when I should have done the other - replacing my own weapon with the dormant blacksmith - prioritizing spamming 4/3s over better choices in my hand). I started playing better and better and seeing some success, but sometimes it still gets genuinely outvalued by Galakrond Rogue and Priest or smorc'd down by Demon Hunter before the mass armor gains kicked in. It performed spectacularly against Warlock and Resurrect Priest which was very satisfying. I don't think the deck has been well-refined and while I wouldn't place any strong bets on it, I feel like there's a version that might really shine in this meta.
I made it to 5 platinum with Highlander Priest and decided I had had enough. I found Highlander Mage to be more effective against DH although neither is top tier. I'm playing around with Egg Warrior thanks to this guide. It really needs to be pointed out that Egg Warrior is nonexistent on HS Replay. This site is a great resource for a shifting meta. I'll also echo some constructive sentiments for a better organization for this article, which is otherwise fantastic.
With regards to Demon Hunter, I'm very happy with the Battlefiend nerf. I think Altruis the Outcast shouldn't do face damage with its ability, but the mana nerf is appreciated. I think Glaivebound Adept needed a mana nerf more than an attack nerf.
I still think Priestess of Fury needs a health nerf to at least 5. And finally, Twin Slice should be nerfed to 1 mana, while KEEPING Second Slice at 0. It's NOT a twinspell! Triggering both for free is broken, even with the Altruis the Outcast nerf.
I played against two Demon Hunters yesterday that both drew threw their ENTIRE deck into fatigue when I still had about 15 cards left. One lost to me, and one killed me from very high health across two turns. I think the amount of draw in each class is actually near-fine at the moment EXCEPT for Demon Hunter which is ridiculously over-powered. The more I play against it, the more I think the fundamental design of the class is broken, starting with a 1-cost hero power. I could suggest half a dozen card nerfs, but I'll stake out the hard position that the entire thing needs an overhaul already. I'm genuinely glad Team-5 went for it, and I want them to experiment in the future, but ladder has basically become unbearable to me, and I've been having fun despite oppressive metas since Undertaker gained +1/+1.
Twin Slice: Change cost to 1-mana and KEEP second slice at 0-mana. It's not a Twinspell. They can do that. It would solve a lot of problems with cards they want to leave OP like Kayn Sunfury.
It has too much health. It should be a 6/5 at minimum. Maybe a 6/4. You should have to really be winning by a lot or protect it with taunt if you expect that effect to trigger twice.
So I beat all 5 chapters last night, and it was an entertaining jog. I'm not going to complain about how easy it was (I even lost twice), but the final test just... ended. It wasn't clear to me what triggered the win condition. I had stabilized at pretty high health and was probably considered to be winning. I don't think I had even knocked down the opponent's HP to even 50% when it stopped and went into the final dialogue. It felt very anti-climactic.
I always argued that because it wasn't a Twinspell keyword that Twin Slice should cost 1 and Second Slice could/should cost 0. Ultimately this is a back-end nerf to Altruis the Outcast.
I'm not sure I've seen a Quest Warrior with Battle Rage. I never felt card draw was a problem. If you get Ancharr as your first weapon (1/3 of the time), then you'll keep getting it back from Hoard Pillager. So the Sky Raiders get drawn and thin your deck. And they're useful combos with Risky Skipper, can generate a Risky Skipper, can generate a taunt, can generate a legendary Pirate, etc. It never felt bad to play/include.
It really does play like a control deck. You're trying to keep the board clear, stabilize your armor, and outvalue your opponent. The burst from Grommash is important, but it's not a combo deck.
I think Greenskin is a reasonable replacement, although [Hearthstone Card (Faceless Corrupter) Not Found] might fill the role a little better.
Gan'arg on 1, Quest on 2 or 3 is a reasonable way to go. I think I did do that a few times. There are so many scenarios to consider!
The other four cards I named - Battlefiend, Satyr Overseer, Altruis the Outcast, and Warglaives of Azzinoth are all OP cards in their own right because of their strong synergy with Demon Hunter's hero power and Chaos Strike, another OP staple of the class (that probably doesn't need a nerf, but boy do I hate how Skull of Gul'dan chains into it). You don't need to nerf those other four, even Altruis, if you deal with Twin Slice.
I really like all these buffs and nerfs, but let's talk Demon Hunter. I'm glad to see the health nerf to 5 on Priestess of Fury. I think it's a strong and balanced card now. Crimson Sigil Runner wasn't on my radar, but it's also a great nerf.
The single most problematic card in Demon Hunter is Twin Slice. It synergizes too well with too many other strong cards. Battlefiend, Satyr Overseer, Altruis the Outcast, and Warglaives of Azzinoth. It needs to be nerfed to 1 mana while keeping Second Slice at 0 mana (it's not a Twinspell!). It goes beyond what's generally considered a fair effect for the cost. We all agree Twin Slice would be broken in Rogue and unplayable in Mage, right? It's equally broken in Demon Hunter. As much as I think Altruis the Outcast shouldn't deal face damage or would like to see further nerfs to the class' draw engine, changing Twin Slice to 1 mana solves so many of these problems on its own.
I'm sure it's a blast to play ;). I can't imagine climbing the ladder without my lackeys from Livewire Lance. Demon Hunters rarely wait long enough to kill you for the bombs to go off. Gan'arg is definitely an odd card, and a decent candidate to swap for something else. It really shines though when you get it in your opening hand with coin.
Extremely necessary. It's the top draw engine for the deck. You'll still have fun if you replace it with Fiery War Axe, but I have to imagine your win-rate will take a big hit. I can't predict the future, but I think Risky Skipper is going to be a Warrior staple for another year until rotation, meaning that Ancharrr will be too. I know Ancharrr was only used for pirate aggro at first, but I think it's an extremely great tool for all archetypes moving forward. I don't think you'll regret crafting it if you like playing Warrior.
LEGEND ACHIEVED. I started from Platinum 5 - 2 stars because I came in off a win-streak. I just completed my 80th game to hit Legend, going 47-33 for a final win-rate of 58.75%. This took me about 6 days, so I was playing about 13-14 per day. Obviously getting to Legend is easier than ever (this is my first time in the new system, second time ever), but I hope sharing these stats helps players understand what it takes.
My greatest losing streak was going from rank 1-2 to rank 2-0, a net loss of 5 stars in a play session. That can be enough to make you quit climbing or question your deck choice or start a new thread about nerfs to whichever card just cost you the last game (but seriously, please nerf Twin Slice).
This deck is extremely hard to pilot, and I made misplays even today. The easiest mistake is forgetting to hero power before attacking, especially when your quest is 4/5 complete for that 2-extra game-making/breaking armor. I'll save the rest for the guide I plan to add to my deck.
Wow, thanks for the shout-out! I was literally playing the Quest Warrior deck as I read this article. I'm currently 35-25 (58%), sitting at Platinum 2 - 3 stars. I'm determined to hit legend with it this month. Theoretically, I'm only about another 25-30 games away, but maybe I'll hit a four game win streak tonight! (The road to legend is still a grind even with the new easier system). I plan to write a guide when I hit legend.
https://outof.cards/hearthstone/decks/15463-hack-the-system
Somewhat unrelated, but any word on when the single player content is supposed to release? Wouldn't this usually be the week given how release schedules have gone the last several cycles. It seems like it's been oddly quiet,
I'm exclusively playing my own variant of Quest Warrior on my road to legend. I started at Platinum 5-2 after coming in on a win streak. I'm 18-12 so far - exactly 60%, BUT 13-7 - 65% in my last 20 games. It's a hard deck to pilot. Tough decisions on what to play or hold on many turns, as well as attack and play order.
https://outof.cards/hearthstone/decks/15463-hack-the-system
The toughest match-ups are Demon Hunter and Rogue, the best classes anyway because of their insane draw engines. But it has the tools to outlast both extreme aggro and extreme value. It takes down all Priest variants very well, and easily outlasts the other Warrior variants. It does very well against Face Hunter and Zoolock, but does struggle against those classes' Highlander variants depending on the draw.
I was playing Quest Warrior for a few days and really thought it was the meta-breaker. It's a really strong deck where I lost several games through genuine misplaying (attacking or not attacking when I should have done the other - replacing my own weapon with the dormant blacksmith - prioritizing spamming 4/3s over better choices in my hand). I started playing better and better and seeing some success, but sometimes it still gets genuinely outvalued by Galakrond Rogue and Priest or smorc'd down by Demon Hunter before the mass armor gains kicked in. It performed spectacularly against Warlock and Resurrect Priest which was very satisfying. I don't think the deck has been well-refined and while I wouldn't place any strong bets on it, I feel like there's a version that might really shine in this meta.
How to fix Demon Hunter:
Twin Slice: Nerf to 1 mana while keeping Second Slice at 0 mana. It's not a twinspell!
Chaos Strike: Nerf to 3 mana.
Skull of Gul'dan: Nerf mana discount to 2 mana.
Priestess of Fury: Nerf health to 5.
Altruis the Outcast: Nerf ability to only damage minions.
I made it to 5 platinum with Highlander Priest and decided I had had enough. I found Highlander Mage to be more effective against DH although neither is top tier. I'm playing around with Egg Warrior thanks to this guide. It really needs to be pointed out that Egg Warrior is nonexistent on HS Replay. This site is a great resource for a shifting meta. I'll also echo some constructive sentiments for a better organization for this article, which is otherwise fantastic.
With regards to Demon Hunter, I'm very happy with the Battlefiend nerf. I think Altruis the Outcast shouldn't do face damage with its ability, but the mana nerf is appreciated. I think Glaivebound Adept needed a mana nerf more than an attack nerf.
I still think Skull of Gul'dan should only provide a 2 mana discount, but even that doesn't really slow Demon Hunter's insane draw engine since it still makes Chaos Strike, Spectral Sight, and Crimson Sigil Runner free. I'd like to see Chaos Strike nerfed to 3 mana to give it a power level more similar to Shield Block.
I still think Priestess of Fury needs a health nerf to at least 5. And finally, Twin Slice should be nerfed to 1 mana, while KEEPING Second Slice at 0. It's NOT a twinspell! Triggering both for free is broken, even with the Altruis the Outcast nerf.
I played against two Demon Hunters yesterday that both drew threw their ENTIRE deck into fatigue when I still had about 15 cards left. One lost to me, and one killed me from very high health across two turns. I think the amount of draw in each class is actually near-fine at the moment EXCEPT for Demon Hunter which is ridiculously over-powered. The more I play against it, the more I think the fundamental design of the class is broken, starting with a 1-cost hero power. I could suggest half a dozen card nerfs, but I'll stake out the hard position that the entire thing needs an overhaul already. I'm genuinely glad Team-5 went for it, and I want them to experiment in the future, but ladder has basically become unbearable to me, and I've been having fun despite oppressive metas since Undertaker gained +1/+1.
Final Hour is an awesomely designed card.
Additional nerfs needed after another week or two:
Skull of Gul'dan: 3-mana discount per card reduced to 2-mana.
Imprisoned Antaen: Battlecry damage reduced from 10 to 8 (it doesn't have to match its attack! Just ask Stormpike Commando!)
Priestess of Fury: Reduce health from 7 to 5.
Twin Slice: Change cost to 1-mana and KEEP second slice at 0-mana. It's not a Twinspell. They can do that. It would solve a lot of problems with cards they want to leave OP like Kayn Sunfury.
It has too much health. It should be a 6/5 at minimum. Maybe a 6/4. You should have to really be winning by a lot or protect it with taunt if you expect that effect to trigger twice.